An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon

Dear WorldCon,

You are cowards.

Several years ago, because some of you were angry at me for getting a bunch of people you don’t like award nominations, us lowly deplorable outsiders with the incorrect kind of politics, you treated my publisher, Toni Weisskopf, like garbage. Years later, after you thought the controversy had safely died off, you felt bad about how you acted and tried to make amends. You invited her to be the Guest of Honor. Only you have no concept of honor. And you screwed her over again.

I’m not here to debate what I did for the umpteenth time. I’m not here to talk to the woke mob you bend the knee to. I’m talking to the regular WorldCon people. I’m here to talk about how you’re fucking pieces of shit who turned your back on someone who was once one of you, someone you called friend, and how after you felt guilty about it years later, you tried to make amends. But the instant it became uncomfortable, you threw her under the bus again.  

Toni had been participating in WorldCons for decades. She grew up in your scene. She volunteered. She hung out with you. She helped out. When she got into the publishing business she kept on helping out, whatever you needed, she was always there for you. She became an editor, and a damned good one too (and you fucking know it).

In fact, she became one of the best and most successful editors in the history of the genre… yet year after year, she got no prestigious award nomination, and instead you just kept giving the award to the same assholes from the same publishing house, over and over and over, as you ignored Toni because she was at that publishing house. The uncouth one. You talk a big game about “honoring strong women” as you took turns rotating through the same cadre of old white dudes for best editor.

It took me, the barbaric outsider, to rally the barbaric outsider fans to finally get Toni some recognition in your sainted halls. And even though your bleating social justice contingent threw a fit, you know what most of you old time, old school, long attending WorldConners told me in private? Good. About time.

Because even though you hated me and my friends (and trust me, we’re cool with that) you knew that Toni deserved it. Toni had earned it. She had long since put in the work. As George R.R. Martin so haughtily proclaimed when he finally admitted I was right all those years ago, and that Hugos were not for everybody (as long claimed) but rather only for your elite select body of special fans, only people who had served their time deserved your fancy awards. Except by every fucking measure in the universe, Toni had served her time.

Then along came the awards, and you snubbed her. Hell, you didn’t just snub her. They openly mocked her, said all sorts of hateful shit, and you people who claimed to be her friends, you old timers who claimed to be all about the sainted dignity of WorldCon, you sat there, silent and afraid, as they did their little high school mean girl games. Toni got up and left the awards ceremony because she wouldn’t give the sicks fucks the satisfaction of watching her endure it. Unlike you, Toni has dignity.

You fuckers talk a big game about tradition. But then the instant there was heat you crumbled before the woke mob that doesn’t give a shit about your precious traditions either. You even renamed one of your awards just to placate their tantrum.

And when those assholes fucked her over last time, you did nothing. Some of you put up some timid posts, but overall you cowered before the mob you helped create, the same one you mocked me for warning you about. People who claimed to be Toni’s friends sat there, silent, worried that if they did the right thing the mob would come for them next. At least they had the decency to stab her in the front. You stabbed her in the back.

Then several years later, after the old controversy I caused had died off and most of us barbaric outsiders had said screw cheesy WorldCon and moved on with our lives, some of you still felt guilty for how you’d treated Toni, so you extended an olive branch. You offered her the Guest of Honor spot at your little convention. How nice. How fucking magnanimous.

Toni, being a far better human being than any of you could ever aspire to be, thought the offer over. She knew there was risks. She knew that she’d take heat from people on the right (and she has). Morons on my side of the political would call her a sell-out, quisling, traitor, boot licker, so on and so forth, and they did. She got attacked by the useless grifters on both sides, looking for hate clicks. But unlike you, Toni ignores the baying mob and always does what she thinks is the right thing to do.  She looked at your peace offering, and said fine, If you want to try and mend fences, okay, I’ll take the heat, I’ll be your guest of honor. She was the bigger person.

She talked to me about her decision. I told her I understood, I wouldn’t do it, but I respected her call, but that she’d surely get yelled at by the idiots on both sides. She already knew, but she thought it was the right thing to do anyway. Because unlike you, Toni actually has a moral compass. Your moral compass is a windsock. Her one mistake in all this was assuming that any of you old time Smofs would have a spine.

Then many months later, after a super contentious and questionable election, when the country is incredibly divided, some little fuckstick, bitter wannabe, alleged writer decided to beg for scraps on Patreon with an “expose” of the alleged evil hatemongery on Baen’s tiny web forum (which Toni has mostly kept around out of tradition, because unlike you fucks she doesn’t just pay lip service to the concept).

This wannabe released a report that was filled with distortions, half-truths, quotes taken out of context, misquotes, errors, innuendo, and outright fucking lies. (and spare me the defense of this dishonest dirtbag, because he’s published like half a dozen pieces of short fic over a decade and has a number of Amazon reviews you can count on your fingers, but with some snooty Nebula noms, so all you old time Smofs know damned good and well exactly what kind of bitter loser poser I’m talking about, because you’ve seen hundreds of them come and go over the years.)

For a far better and more eloquent dismantling of just what a disingenuous hit piece this is, you can read David Weber or Eric Flint’s very detailed takes. David is on the right. Eric is on the left. They can come across the aisle and agree that Jason Sanford is a lying sack of shit. As for me, I’m all out of eloquence. You fuckers are lucky dueling is illegal.

Of course, once called on his lies and obvious horseshit, the guy cries about harassment and plays the victim. Predictable as fucking clockwork. The crusade is picked up by the usual suspects. Worthless vultures looking for hate clicks, the lot of them, and again, you old timers know exactly what parasitic weirdos I’m talking about.

Once you discard the bullshit and stuff that was cherry picked from years ago from that report, at worst a handful of angry no names talked shit that wouldn’t even stand out on Facebook or Twitter (while Sanford acts like this is all happening in a vacuum and current events don’t exist). And if you think that’s bad then you need to get out of your echo chambers and get out into red state America because they are sick of your shit. I’ve heard more subversive conversations recently at my local small town grocery store between literal grandmas than that.

But this nonsense “report” comes out (and is immediately used to try and get the entire publishing house deplatformed off the internet, which would kill our ebook sales, which would financially fuck over hundreds of authors, bipartisan authors, many of which are also supposedly your friends, only you don’t give a shit about that), Toni takes the forum down in self-defense and says she’ll look into the posts in question, but the woke mob erupts as they always do, crying for Toni’s head… And what do you do in response?

You fold like a cheap lawn chair. You kick your guest of honor. So much for your olive branch. So much for your bullshit reaching across the divide.

You cowards disgust me. You’ve got no heart, no spine, and no balls. None of you are worthy to clean Toni’s toilet.

You’re also fucking hypocrites, because if the new WorldCon standard is “some random anonymous assholes said bad things in a space that is nominally under your umbrella, ever, you’re out.” we all know that if applied evenly, that bullshit standard would remove most of your guests.  At least all of them who has ever been on the internet, because we’ve all seen the horrible, hateful, cruel, downright fucking evil shit posted in their corners for years.

Oh, but wait… Those comments get a pass. Those always get a fucking pass, no matter how outlandish. If you didn’t have double standards you’d have no standards at all. Re-education camps? Pass. Just drone bomb whoever won’t turn in their guns? Pass. Kill the racists and everybody I don’t like is automatically declared racist? Pass. How many lefty author pages have comments on them right now dancing in blood because a 70-year-old right wing celebrity just died of lung cancer? How about that for your “policy of inclusion”.

You’re about as familiar with the concept of inclusion as you are honor.

Speaking of your mealy-mouthed, wishy washy, double standards… Would booting Toni be more misogynistic? Or Anti-Semitic?  Sorry. My bad. My side isn’t the one who gets to ignore every criticism because of identity politics. That’s also a one-way street.

Naw. It isn’t a street. It’s a river of shit that only flows one way.

Some of you know it, but you’re too scared to talk. You’re the ones who piss me off the most. The ones who come to me at events in confidence or send me sheepish emails about what goes on behind the scenes, and how you recognize the rot, the fucking cancer in the bones of your organization. But you do nothing, you say nothing in public, you never take a stand, and so you get bulldozed. Great. You fucking deserve it, cowards. You know who you are.  

It’s kind of funny, actually (sad funny, that is). You rallied together to drive me and my people off, and once we were gone, you started eating each other. That’s because you’ve allowed the creation of a mob that is addicted to outrage, and addicts don’t just stop. You allowed it to grow, and now it’s bigger and more powerful in your organization than you are. So with no outspoken people with the wrong politics to attack, you attacked each other. Hell, you let them cancel John Campbell! Toni came back and that gave them a new target, but now that she’s gone (and no openly conservative or libertarian author or editor should ever be gullible enough to take your GoH offer ever again) the mob will go back to cancelling you Smofs. Have fun giving your awards to whoever gave last year’s angriest award speech about how you and everyone you’ve ever enjoyed reading was evil.  

Toni is better than you. America is better than you. The world is better than you. On a deep and personal level, I’m glad you keep going out of your way to prove that I was right about you all along. As you ride your little canoe down your shit river into obscurity and irrelevance, the rest of us will say good riddance. We’ll be over here enjoying books and trying not to get cancelled, while you hang out with the book burners cosplaying an Orwell novel.

Good luck.

Larry F. Correia

Yard Moose Mountain, Utah.

p.s. the “good luck” was sarcastic. You shit heads deserve each other.

March Update Post
RIP Mr. Limbaugh

468 thoughts on “An Open Letter To The Old Time Fans at WorldCon”

    1. Man this was a righteous read. You’re right that so many “prestigious” Sci-fi / fantasy conferences and awards have fallen so far in the last 10-15 years as to be rendered worthless and/or pathetic jokes unworthy of any respect.

      Keep up the good fight and keep writing those excellent books.

        1. Jeff, I wish this post had a like button…because you nailed it, brother. If I see a book has a literary award other than a Dragon Award, I avoid it like the plague.

          1. It does! There on the right, a list of books available for purchase. There’s your “like” button right there.

          1. “Good thing enough people disagree with you to pay for this giant ass mansion I built on my own mountain.”

            Hahahahahahahaha!! I know, right!!?? Johnny Boi has the tell-tale last name. Gotta be related with that kind of arrogant stupidity.
            Who was it who said the best revenge was to live well, or something like that?

            Charlie Mike, Mr. Correia!

          2. I must applaud Mr. Clinton’s efficiency of commenting. That may be the most maximally packed density of stupid I’ve ever seen. Such idiocy in so few words!

          3. My husband started listening to the Monster Hunter audio books (He’s up to #6 or #7.) And he comes up to me the other day and says, “You know, Larry is GOOD.” Meaning, not just entertaining in a wholly acceptable pulp/hack way, but a phenomenal writer.

            I sort of raised my eyebrow at him and said something about having told him so.

            What gets missed sometimes I think *because* of how entertaining all of Larry’s books are, is the level of skill and craft, of literature that is going on. Unless you’re paying attention on purpose it’s easy to miss because the story and characters carry you away.

            If you’re a writer trying to learn and paying attention it’s incredibly eye opening.

        1. Politely disagreeing with someone’s politics or likes is one thing. Calling their work crap because you disagree with them is just childish.

    2. I especially liked ‘You Fu@#3r$ are lucky dueling is illegal’ comment.

      In other words for the entire PLD/DNC/Cancel culture worms;

      April 29th, ‘Not my Presidents!’ Day is coming! Share with friends and enemies.

  1. Pro Tip: Dueling is legal in Delaware.

    But let’s face it. None of these prolapsed sphincters have the courage or self-respect to accept a challenge.

    1. However, as was noted on a previous thread, gentlemen generally only engage in dueling with those who they acknowledge as social equals.

      And these people…aren’t.

    2. Heh, that’s interesting. Wonder when the last time a legal duel was held.

      That being said, that line was the one part I didn’t enjoy from this otherwise passionate and evocative post. You know that it’s going to get taken out of context and classified as a “death threat.”

      1. Legal duel? Recently. Dueling is legal in several states. One has fairly specific rules on what makes something a legal duel. There was litigation — iirc in the last decade — as to whether a particular event satisfied the legal requirements for being a duel.

  2. I’m still having trouble dealing with the fact that I grew up around these people, or at least people close to them. It wasn’t until my teens that I got connected with “our” side. So weird that the same people who educated me in writing and publishing are now the villains in this fairy tale.

    1. Some people grow. Some people ossify.

      And some people turn themselves into horror shows or Karens. They love control and hatred, or being eaten last, more than they love anyone else.

      But those people have to live with themselves, somehow. Even ossification is better than that.

    2. Sadly, I had to go eBook and give up over 4,000 hardcover and paperback SciFi and fantasy works I had bought over the years, some dating to when I was in my teens and they were priced at $0.95, when I moved from a long term apartment I had filled with custom bookshelves to a regular apartment a few years back. But to buttress your opinion on WorldCon, I had long ago stopped buying the annual Hugo award winners compilations. I didn’t know why at the time, but it was obvious that the winning shorts were no longer worth reading. It took your puppyhood for me to discover the reason was the awards had become a literary circle jerk where the object was to make the authors feel good rather than pander to making plebeian deplorables like the readers feel good.

      Pro Tip to WorldCon “authors” – Shakespeare, Gilbert & Sullivan, pretty much any “classic” form of entertainment which became regarded as high class and endured as such for more than one generation started life as entertainment for everyone – not just the highly educated and/or socially well off.

  3. All I can say is ‘yes.’ (And thank you.) I’ve been told I should have been consigned to the pit with you ‘where I belong’ before, and I should have listened.

    Better late than never.

    1. You tried to help, over at SFWA. You tried to get them to listen. Nothing that they do to themselves can be blamed on you. Just sorry that your efforts were wasted on them, when they could have turned around. Maybe some will eventually figure it out.

      1. Thank you. I had good intentions, but I was naive. I didn’t understand how much the establishment had to protect, and how much I was threatening them with my ideas. It would never have worked.

        I wish the people who stayed behind in the hopes of righting the sinking ship the best of luck, and hope the process doesn’t chew them up as thoroughly as it did me.

        On the bright side, at least now I make money, something I was failing at when I was trying, very hard, to walk their path. :,

          1. I remember you! It’s good to hear from you. I’m still around, just on other platforms (I’m moving from cancel-happy Patreon to Locals now.) 🙂

            I am not rock star successful, certainly, but I was at least able to replace my day job. I like working for myself a lot better than I did working in a cube. I will take it, even it’s not the future I hoped when I was a kid in Waldenbooks, reading about the SFWA Musketeers and daydreaming about one day being in bookstores on shelves. (Who could have known that so many bookstores would simply vanish?)

          2. “it’s not the future I hoped when I was a kid in Waldenbooks”
            Man, I miss Waldenbooks. That was one of my joys as a kid, going into a Waldernbooks and searching the SFF sections.

  4. If they had been glibly discussing shooting cops (“ACAB!” ✊) or drone-striking insurrectionists or taking Trump supporters’ kids away from them, that would have been just fine.

    Their violence is speech, your speech is violence. They’ll defend people who burned an actual bookstore to the ground because some Minneapolis cop choked a guy to death. They’ll defend literal book-burning so long as it’s done by someone they’re afraid to criticize.

    Pointing out they hypocrisy is almost pointless because they don’t see it as hypocrisy. They’re the good guys and you’re a Nazi.

    The Balkanization of American society continues apace. This isn’t going to go the way they think.

    1. “…some Minneapolis cop choked a guy to death…”

      Minor correction Mike, the stupid bastard died of a fentanyl overdose. If not for the elephant tranquilizer sized dose of opiates, he’d have lived. Kneeling on his neck for 8 minutes was bullshit, don’t get me wrong, but not fatal in and of itself.

      Other than that, right on.

          1. Problem with dueling cowardly backshooters is that they’ll try to shoot you in the back. *koff*Pavel Young*koff*

        1. I recall the guy from the hospital testified that he would have died no matter what anybody did, even if he’d taken the drugs right in the emergency room of the hospital. It was a -big- overdose.

          I love it that some low-information SJW is shrieking “raaaacist!” right now too. That makes my day.

          1. Someone watched closely on the bodycam footage, he swallowed some drugs when the police first approached him.

      1. Roger that, Phantom! Autopsy revealed ZERO trauma to ANY part of the neck (C1-C7, Hyoid, trachea, etc.). He OD’d.

        The entire frickin’ country was gas-lighted.

    2. The guy that was “choked to death by a cop,” most likely died from having enough Fentanyl in his system to choke a donkey.

      1. Elephant. It was testified to at the cop’s trial. Overdose, -big- one.

        I notice the SJWs never seem to wonder how many lives were -saved- that day by the cops getting that guy out from behind the wheel of a car.

        The cop with the knee on the neck was wrong too, and an asshole, but SJWs just don’t seem to grasp the mechanics of the whole situation.

        1. Except the knee on the back was (still is?) very literally a textbook police procedure of WHAT. TO. DO. with OD’ers.

          Funny… no one mentions that in MSM…. or the fact that he was alive another HOUR after leaving the scene and croaked to death in the hospital.

          The full bodycam video showing how utterly pathetic Floyd was is almost heartbreaking to watch.

          1. I didn’t know that. I really thought he died on the ground there.

            And I’m among those who doubted the reporting and consequent riots.


    3. And the sad part about ‘the cop choked the guy’ is the cop didn’t. The guy self-slabbed on a double handful of his own stash, just like he did the year before. (Yep, Floyd ‘died’ the year before but was brought back.)

      The cop was in the right. The dead guy was in the wrong.

      Simple as that.

        1. yeah, the medical examiners weren’t willing to rule he died of an overdose after months of violent riots where 40 people were murdered and multiple residential buildings were lit on fire WITH PEOPLE INSIDE. Gee, I wonder why they were so hesitant?

          However the medical examiner DID say this “Baker said that Floyd’s toxicology report showed he had a fatal level of fentanyl under normal circumstances and that if he were found dead at home alone and no other apparent causes, this could be acceptable to call an OD.”

          they also said this: “no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation.”

          both autopsies agree he had a fatal amount of fentanyl in his blood. they disagree on the cause of death. One said heart failure, the other said asphyxiation. The fact that they dont agree indicates there is no strong evidence either way. So I’m gonna go with the most likely. He OD’d on fentanyl and the medical examiners dont want to say so because they are scared a violent mob will burn their house down or murder their family.

          even in the double talk and butt covering they still admit that the knee on the neck by itself COULD NOT HAVE KILLED HIM. Both medical examiners claim it was a COMBINATION of restraint AND THE DRUGS IN HIS SYSTEM that killed him. Meaning without the drug overdose he would not have died.

          So if you parse that out, BOTH autopsies confirm that floyd died of multiple causes. They both confirm the restraint AND the fentanyl combined killed him. They both admit the restraint BY ITSELF did not and could not kill him and they both admit that the drugs BY THEMSELVES could have and would have killed him. but somehow we cant say he died of an overdose because . . .
          an angry mob might murder your family if you say that.

          If I say person x died of a combination of a gunshot wound to the head and having a ring on his finger, that statement IS TRUE even if the ring had nothing to do with his death. He did get shot in the head and he did have a ring on his finger. Both of those factors WERE present when he died. So it is TRUE (but misleading) to say he died of a combination of factors. However it is obvious the ring couldn’t kill anyone and the gunshot BY ITSELF could have and likely did.

          this is the same situation we have here. Floyds death was almost certainly an OD because the fentanyl could have killed him on its own and would have killed him no matter what else happened. So why do we need to add in the restraints when we know they couldn’t have killed him on their own and we know he was already dying of an OD? Simple, to placate and angry violent mob. Thats why.

          I rate your fact check as blithering stupidity.

          1. Actually, the actual ME results (not the one paid for by Floyd’s family) doesn’t claim that the restraint had anything to do with the death beyond Floyd dying while it was happening. The statement “cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression” means that the cardiopulmonary arrest (either the heart or the lungs stopped working ie heart attack or asphyxiation/pulmonary edema) complicated, ie interfered with the arrest. Nowhere in the actual cause of death statement is the claim that the arrest actually caused it.
            The ME the Floyd family paid to do the autopsy determined Floyd died of asphyxia. Asphyxia is a general inability to breath. While strangulation does cause asphyxia, we must once again refer to the “no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation.” This means that it is virtually impossible for Chauvin’s knee to have cut off airflow and so we must search for a different source for the asphyxia.
            The asphyxia was likely caused by massive water in the lungs (pulmonary edema). While we can’t say 100% what caused the pulmonary edema to occur, it can’t occur due to the neck restraint, and is a known negative side effect of fentanyl, which again Floyd had 11 ng/ML in his blood, with a lethal dose being possible at 4, and the maximum amount doctors prescribe being between .6 – 3 ng/ML.

          2. Uh-huh.

            “This means that Floyd stopped breathing and his heart stopped beating (cardiopulmonary arrest) because of the injury caused by his restraint in the custody of law enforcement officers, to include asphyxia from neck compression. Asphyxia means that there is a lack of oxygen going to the brain. It can happen from obstruction of the airway, restriction of breathing from compression of the neck or chest, or the prevention of blood flow to the brain by collapsing the blood vessels in the neck. It can also happen from the replacement of oxygen in the blood by carbon monoxide, or depletion of oxygen in the atmosphere, like in a fire. “Cardiopulmonary arrest” is not a heart attack. Online sources that imply that the medical examiner is covering up George Floyd’s death by calling it a “heart attack” are wrong.”


            And that’s from this person –

            “Dr. Melinek is a American Board of Pathology board-certified forensic pathologist practicing forensic medicine in San Francisco, California, and CEO of PathologyExpert Inc.

            Dr. Melinek trained in pathology at University of California, Los Angeles and then as a forensic pathologist at the New York City Medical Examiner’s Office from 2001-2003. She has consulted and testified in criminal and civil cases in Alaska, Arizona, California, Florida, Illinois, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Texas and Washington.

            Dr. Melinek has been qualified as an expert witness in forensic pathology, neuropathology and wound interpretation. She has had subspecialty training in surgery and has published and consulted on cases of medical malpractice and therapeutic complications. She trains doctors and attorneys on forensic pathology, proper death reporting and certification. She has been invited to lecture at professional conferences on the subjects of death certification, complications of therapy, forensic toxicology and in-custody deaths. She has also published extensively in the peer-reviewed literature on subjects of surgical complications, death following gastric bypass, forensic toxicology, opioid overdose deaths, immunology, neuropathology and transplant surgery.”

    4. Back in the 1940s the U.S. and her allies bombed the living daylights out of Germany. And do not get me started on Japan.

      Did the U.S. bomb Chicago? Rio do Sul? And we all *know* that blowing people (including kids!) to smithereens us wrong. [Redacted Expurgated] hypocrites!

      But… But.. The U.S.A. was* at war with Germany*-!


      Better to figure it out sooner than later. Eowyn was right.

      (*anyone else get cross eyed putting “was” instead of “were”? Betcha it’d be an interesting thing to track down – when it changed.)

      1. The consensus seems to be that it changed in the wake of the Civil War, but I haven’t done the research to know how accurate that is.

      2. I think the “was” vs. “were” thing in that context might be an American vs. British English thing. I know the British treat company names as if they were plural nouns, while Americans treat them as if they were singular nouns. I.e. a British person will say “Microsoft were founded by Bill Gates” while an American will say “Microsoft was founded by Bill Gates”. I haven’t checked whether it’s the same usage for countries as for companies.

    5. Your speech is violence.

      Your silence is also violence.

      Actually… your mere *existence* may be violence.

      (They may have already gone as far as that last one. It’s hard to keep up and satire is nearly impossible these days…)

    6. They’ll defend people who burned an actual bookstore to the ground because some Minneapolis cop choked a guy to death.

      Said event would never have happened if said (black) guy wasn’t choked by said (white) cop thus leading to the riot that resulted in the store burning down (and, IMHO [frankly] one must ask what said sci-fi bookstore was doing in a black neighborhood?) And why does (North) American society let its (non-chain) bookstores (and other independent mom & pop businesses) be driven out of the main streets of most cities due to high rents and condogentrification (also, when are {North] Americans going to realize that many cities are becoming clone towns []) because of this?

      As a fan of science fiction and fantasy, and also as a person of color who’s a fans of science fiction and fantasy, I’m sorry that this building got burned down , but the life of a black person who was chokeholded to death by a white cop means and meant more to the people rioting than a sci-fi bookstore, as hard as it is to accept (and no, you can’t blame Black Lives Matter-which is not a centralized organization with top-down leaders who dictate policy as if lead by a central council-for this, any [if they exist] leaders never said that somebody should burn down this bookstore.)

      With regards to the matter under discussion, I’m sorry that Ms. Weisskopf got treated like this, but neoconservatives were (and have been) out of control ever since Trump got elected (attacking people and being violent, with some groups like The Proud Boys now ending up classified as terrorist organizations by some governments), and after that debacle in Washington by the right wing, nobody’s in any mood to allow anybody who they might consider to be part of the debacle or or of the alt-right to be allowed to have any kind of speech (a PSA says this better than I can: If Ms. Weisskopf failed to notice how extreme some of the postings were on the forum in question, and didn’t get the persons responsible to shape up or ship off, people are going to accuse her of being in league with them, and get her dismissed from her job or the BBS deplatformed. Like it or not, fascism has been rearing its ugly head, and many people are engaging (rightly or wrongly) in a form of denazification as happened in post-WWII Germany; nobody’s taking any more shit from the right after that debacle in Washington, and they want any fascism, racism, homophobia, and sexism that happened under Trump and because of Trump being POTUS squelched (and with reference to one of the links I posted about free speech, they have the right to do so.) This whole fine state of affairs* (to quote a Burton Cummings song) has been terrible for everybody, and now it’s destroyed this woman, as Larry claims. But being a part of what people consider fascism/racism/homophobia/sexism has (sadly) in her case come back to hurt her.

      I only hope that she’s all right, and that she can weather this storm; this should have never happened to her.


      1. If Black Lives Matter isn’t responsible for torching the bookstore, why are you defending it? Can you not be against police brutality and arson at the same time, or is it a one or the other deal now?

        In at least one of the 700+ businesses that were torched in Minneapolis, they found the charred remains of someone who was trapped inside the building. Clearly that person’s life didn’t matter. Inconvenient to even bring up, really.

        These people will support crushing all dissent and burning your business down, and feel great about it, because you’re the bad guy. ACAB until they kill someone they don’t like, like Ashli Babbit, then they’re heroes. When they try to burn down a federal courthouse, it’s fighting fascism. If a bunch of people invade the Capitol Building, it’s an insurrection that demands the harshest possible response. Only if it’s Trump supporters, though; if BLM had staged an occupation of the Capitol Building the fellow above would be defending it, even if it had resulted in an equal number of injuries or deaths. Remember, he’s perfectly willing to defend *burning a bookstore down* if he thinks the arsonists are nominally on his team.

        It seems like hypocrisy but to them, it’s not. You’re the bad guy and they’re the good guy. Don’t forget that.

        “Sure, those books got burned, but they were FASCIST books!”

        “Why is the Army occupying DC? To stop FASCISM!”

        “We have to force those news networks off the air to stop FASCISM!”

        “This merger of governmental and corporate power is necessary to counteract FASCISM!”

        How long until “we need to round these people up and send them to camps to fight fascism”?

        They’ll even type up a big long comment crying about imaginary fascism and then whine that you’re pulling a Godwin when you use the same kind of rhetoric.

        1. If Black Lives Matter isn’t responsible for torching the bookstore, why are you defending it? Can you not be against police brutality and arson at the same time, or is it a one or the other deal now?

          The destruction of the bookstore was (unfortunate) collateral damage resulting from a riot the was ultimately caused by the death of a black man by a white policeman, not by BLM (again, not a centralized organization but a decentralized movement). So basically, what you’re saying is that all that matters to you is not black lives that can’t be replaced, but a burned down bookstore that can be (and is) being replaced ( Check.

          In at least one of the 700+ businesses that were torched in Minneapolis, they found the charred remains of someone who was trapped inside the building. Clearly that person’s life didn’t matter. Inconvenient to even bring up, really.

          You do know that this kind of thing happens in riots, right? And usually to black people? (using black people to beat up other black people, check.)

          These people will support crushing all dissent and burning your business down, and feel great about it, because you’re the bad guy. ACAB until they kill someone they don’t like, like Ashli Babbit, then they’re heroes. When they try to burn down a federal courthouse, it’s fighting fascism. If a bunch of people invade the Capitol Building, it’s an insurrection that demands the harshest possible response. Only if it’s Trump supporters, though; if BLM had staged an occupation of the Capitol Building the fellow above would be defending it, even if it had resulted in an equal number of injuries or deaths. Remember, he’s perfectly willing to defend *burning a bookstore down* if he thinks the arsonists are nominally on his team.

          (Not able to tell the difference between fascist terrorists of a fascist cult ( (and also invading a governmental center and the consequence resulting from a racist wrong done to a black person, check (and Larry wonders why he and others like him get dis-invited to conventions sometimes?)

          It seems like hypocrisy but to them, it’s not. You’re the bad guy and they’re the good guy. Don’t forget that.

          Can’t understand the fascism happening in his own country, and invents boogeymen/ boogeywomen from progressive movements that he can cast aspersions on, check.

          “Sure, those books got burned, but they were FASCIST books!”

          “Why is the Army occupying DC? To stop FASCISM!”

          “We have to force those news networks off the air to stop FASCISM!”

          “This merger of governmental and corporate power is necessary to counteract FASCISM!”

          More of the same clueless butthurt white dude neocon bleating as above, check.

          They’ll even type up a big long comment crying about imaginary fascism and then whine that you’re pulling a Goodwin when you use the same kind of rhetoric.

          Rinse, lather, and repeat.

          All that I’ve seen spoken above shows how much of a cluelessly butthurt (white?) person you are, but what else is new?

          1. Once again, learn what neocon and fascism actually means. The capitol riot was the result of a mix of Trump supporters and leftists involved in false flag operations to try and discredit the people calling for investigation into the reports of rampant fraud from the 2020 election.
            George Floyd wasn’t even being detained due to racism. Even if you want to use the false claim that Chauvin killed Floyd, a white police officer with a history of excessive violence using excessive violence against a black man is not racism. Despite several deep dives of Chauvin’s life, nobody ever found any evidence of racial animus.
            Before you return with the stupid claims about institutional racism, be aware that every honest study about lethal force and race returns the following results: white people are killed by police in a higher number than are black people, black people are killed at a higher per capita rate than white people, but when actually using indices of violent criminality ie arrests for rape, assault, and murder, their is no significant difference in cases of being killed by the police. Some studies have suggested blacks face higher adverse responses from police other than being killed ie violence, being handcuffed, being detained, but all of those studies also included the NYC stop and frisk policies that were specifically targeted at young African Americans due to something like 90% of homicides in NYC being committed by young African Americans or against young African Americans.
            Therefore, to claim that this Floyd is a result of racism is ignorant and an example of the idiocy of the left’s intersectionality bs everything is racist, homophobic, whatever else they can claim.
            Also, I want to remind you that a not insignificant portion of the alt-right, particularly Richard Spencer and his minions supported Biden in 2020, because it turns out that when Trump was talking about America First and the supremacy of Western Civilization he was including African Americans as full members, and they felt betrayed that Trump wasn’t actually racist.
            To be clear, you are saying that a group of people where some forcefully entered, and others were told they were allowed to enter by the capitol police after specifically asking if it was okay is an instance of facism. Does this mean that the myriad attempts from BLM, Anti-Fa and other leftist groups to burn down courthouses, and other federal facilities is also facism. If not, why not and what is the difference besides them being on your team? If Trump is responsible for these people, does that mean that Sanders is responsible for the gunman who shot Steve Scalise and the Republican Congressional Baseball Team? Is AOC responsible for the people who tried to burn down the immigration holding facilities with immigrants inside? Is Kamala Harris responsible for the continued riots in Minnesota after tweeting things like a riot is the voice of the unheard and links to the fund paying their bail?
            George Floyd’s life can’t be replaced. Of course, neither can David Dorn’s or the other 40+ people murdered in these riots. BLM agitators shot several motorists for the crime of driving near their protests. Also, to suggest that the only property people are upset about is Uncle Hugo’s is idiocy. Uncle Hugo’s is, however, the most recognizable property destroyed that relates to cancel culture around SFF and worldcon, which were the original subjects of the post. The actual human cost of these riots is incalculable – in years to come the areas with the strongest riots will see massive economic downturns relative to the areas around them. Economic downturns relative to surrounding neighborhoods tends to drive the soft bigotry of low expectations, trapping the African Americans who live there, with fewer being willing to try and make an honest living (which for a lot of young men tends to increase likelihood they join a gang), which results in more violence, and another generation of African Americans being left behind. One stark example was Baltimore, which never really recovered from the riots in 68 after the assassination of Martin Luther King Jr.

          2. Clueless white person? I’ll have you know that Mike Kupari is the same exact color as Sean King! 😀

            If that was supposed to be a fisking, it was kinda pathetic. Leave this to the professionals.

          3. See Blake, you think I’m clueless and that I don’t understand your argument.

            I understand it just fine. You’re saying that the riots were the result of a police brutality incident, therefore the police are responsible for the riots (and all of the death and destruction that followed), not the people who did the rioting.

            It’s a convenient argument. It allows you to acknowledge all of the damage and death while absolving the people who committed those acts of doing it. That’s how you can sit here and lecture me about how much life matters while shrugging off the lives lost in the riot, which you think was righteous and justified.

            So no, it’s not that I don’t understand your argument, it’s just that your argument is dumb.

            Your attitude is exactly as I said it was: to you, your team are the good guys, therefore their actions are justified. The other team (the “Trump cultists”) are the bad guys (fascists, even!), so everything they do is bad.

            This isn’t some complex or nuanced argument. You can spend a few hundred more words rationalizing it if you want, but it boils down to simple political partisanship.

            The only people responsible for burning down Uncle Hugo’s are the fuckheads who started the fire.

            Not the Minneapolis police.

            Not society.

            Not societal racism.

            Nobody made them do it. They had a choice, and they chose to commit arson.

            Similarly, the people responsible for the Capitol Riot are the people who went into the building. Nobody else.

            Call me a fascist all you want. Call me racist. Call me whatever names you can come up with. I don’t care. You clearly don’t know what a neoconservative is, much less what the definition of fascism is.

            You know what the Nazis *were* fond of? Categorizing people by race. The concept of collective racial guilt. Racial hierarchies. The woke kids have this in common with white supremacists and it’s hilarious.

            The only one here commenting on anybody’s skin color is you, my dude.

            If society and the system are as racist as you think they are, then you ought to be careful what you wish for. The domestic war on terror they want to counter the threat of “fascism” with? That’ll get turned on you eventually. Handing a racist system a bunch of new surveillance and policing powers doesn’t seem like a great strategy to me, but what do I know? ????

          4. Also, are you assuming the arsonists were black? I’m not. The ATF caught some kid who had run to Colorado in connection with the torching of a police precinct. He was white, ANTIFA affiliated I think. ????‍♂️

      2. ” (and, IMHO [frankly] one must ask what said sci-fi bookstore was doing in a black neighborhood?) ”
        They have been there since the 1970s.
        Are black neighborhoods not allowed to have books?
        What the fuck is wrong with you?
        “And why does (North) American society let its (non-chain) bookstores (and other independent mom & pop businesses) be driven out of the main streets of most cities due to high rents and condogentrification”
        So… book stores are only allowed in shopping complexes that have Panera Bread franchises and lots of people wearing crocs and golf shirts?

        The bizarre dichotomy of justifying a whole bunch of stupid shit (conducted by democrats) because other stupid shit happened (also conducted by a democrat PD with a democrat police chief in a democrat city with a democrat city council and democrat AG, prosecutors, and judges) is painful to read.
        But that’s right. Dipshit Cosplay Day at the Capitol is totally the same as 80 days of nonstop rioting around the country, ergo Toni should just end free speech because somebody might eventually say something “extreme” that some dishonest piece of shit might take out of context in order to get the vapors over, whether it is actually extreme or not.

        And I never said this “destroyed” her. She’s far stronger than you mopes. This was simply a bunch of fucking dirtbags demonstrating their moral bankruptcy to the world.

        Fuck off.

        1. As for “main street” Uncle Hugos was on a modern “main street”, across from the Sheraton and the International Market food court, and shared a parking lot with Popeyes and a dentist’s office.

          The entire crux of your bullshit post comes down to this line ” But being a part of what people consider fascism/racism/homophobia/sexism has (sadly) in her case come back to hurt her.”
          The part you seem to miss is that the real problem is that cancel culture assholes have so drastically changed the definitions of those bad things to include pretty much every fucking thing under the sun.
          And once they redefine everything that isn’t lockstep adherence to their orthodoxy as some ist or ism, then they set out trying to wreck people’s lives.
          While cowards like you cheer them on.
          Which is why the rest of us laugh when the eventually run out of targets and turn on you too, when you inevitably aren’t pure enough to suit them. Because that shit is hilarious.

        2. Yeah, I loved the racism implied by the supposed anti-racist that it’s a bad thing for Uncle Hugos to have been in a black neighborhood.

          These dimwits really end up showing their true colors just by trying to sound smart, and failing catastrophically as a result.

      3. Point of fact – BLM riots happened because a Black Man died of a fentanyl overdose while being subdued by a white police officer. The knee on the neck for 8 minutes was excessive, particularly since the issue they were having (Floyd wasn’t getting all the way into the back seat of the police vehicle) was rendered moot by them calling an ambulance for him regardless. The cause of death for Floyd was “cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint and neck compression.” The autopsy “revealed no physical findings that support a diagnosis of traumatic asphyxia or strangulation.”
        Floyd had a heart attack and pulmonary edema, with lungs 2-3 times the normal weight. If you watched the fully released video from the police officers bodycam, Floyd was already starting to go into pulmonary arrest when the police officers first tried arresting him and long before he was placed in the subdual hold.
        Governments classifying groups as terrorist groups or not means fairly little – unless you agree that antifa is a terrorist organization because Trump declared them to be so?
        As far as blaming the BLM organization for these actions, when the central organization supports riots and looting, then yes they can be blamed. If the central BLM organization had condemned the rioting / looting / murders conducted by the satellite BLM in their name, then yes you could claim that due to the decentralized nature of the different BLM alliances the main organization isn’t responsible.
        As far as your comments about neoconservatives, you should know neoconservatives are the Rumsfeld / Cheney / Bush wing of the Republican party who hate Trump and are trying to take the January 6 riot at the capitol to mean that Trump is ineligible for office under the 14th amendment. Given that you are engaged in making up your own set of facts, your opinion on this is laughable.

        1. The only thing that local BLM groups got up to that I can remember the national level BLM condemning was a community picnic with police meant to reduce tensions and let everyone get to know each other.

          “This is not what we stand for.”

          1. Wow, politifact? That’s kind of embarrassing to use, particularly with a fact check that kept trying to split hairs and ignored anything running counter to the narrative . The reality is that Floyd died of a combination of heart attack and pulmonary edema without any trauma from the knee restraint. The manner of death is something that only counts as statistics but has zero legal weight in testimony or judicial processes. Given the reality of the situation, the coroner wasn’t going to put overdose in something that only counts towards the narrative and state statistics. Again, the actual facts from the autopsy: fentanyl levels nearly three times the lethal limit. No physical damage to the airways as a result of Chauvins knee. His lungs weighed 2-3 times as much as they should have due to liquid in them. Floyd would have died had he been magically teleported to an ER at the moment Chauvin first interacted with him.

      4. Blake, Blake ,Blake you seem to have forgotten for one small moment that BLM was created by Putin (as detailed in the Mueller indictment of the IRA) and when you get done with that reading maybe you should try the autopsy report on Floyd or Blake himself admitting to having a weapon.
        BLM riots based on rumors and when the actual facts come to light showing them false never once acknowledges that.

        Maybe you should read what the actual fascists believed instead of the idiotic Kremlin strawman, I would suggest googling 25 points platform since it’s an easy read and face the fact that BLM follows vastly more points of the fascist political platform than the President who passed prison reform and had minorities working in record numbers at the highest inflation adjusted average wage in US history.

        And possibly if the collective you feels the needs to be out on the street all night “doing something” maybe you can interfere the the thousands of black on black murders that the actual measurable facts show.

      5. Amongst all the other things people have pointed out, why are you repeatedly calling current Republicans NeoCons when most of the prominent NeoCons were the NeverTrump Crowd that supported Clinton and then Biden? I mean, many of them wrote a weekly column for the last four years on how “this time, for sure, I’m leaving the Republican party right now”, it was kind of hard to miss.

        If you can’t even get that minimal level of classification right, why should I assume that you understand literally anything else?

        1. Because adding the word “neo” makes something sound extra scary?

          (I actually wish people would stop doing this with “neo-liberal” because it just sounds really dumb.)

      6. ‘XKCD’ supports and encourages rioting by the BLM. And the cartoon you posted is completely wrong where the Bar is concerned. When an outside entity demands it be shut down, that *is* a violation of the first amendment rights of;

        Baen Publishing.




        Tom Kratman.

        David Weber.

        John Ringo.

        Eric Flynn.

        And everyone else who wishes to speak in the Bar.

        As to blaming the Cops for the riots? That is elementary school stupid, because it does not mention one serious FACT you are hoping people will forget. Floyd was not chosen at random by a few ‘WHITE COPS!’ for harassment. He was INVOLVED IN CRIMINAL ACTIVITY when Police were arresting him. So the riots happened because George Floyd was a criminal, not a sainted martyr.

        1. Not only that, the riots happened because George Floyd OD’d on enough fentanyl to literally kill a horse. Or, about 6 George Floyds.

          Floyd died at a hospital more than an hour after being ‘choked to death by police’. That’s just not how asphyxiation works.

          When those facts come out in the trial of Derek Chauvin, watch the feral mobs crank the riots up to 11.

          There will be a lot more George Floyds now that the border is open.

      1. My first thought was to argue with you Jason, those authors didn’t do anything evil to get nominated. (Okay -maybe- most of them did but surely there’s an innocent in there somewheres…)

        But on reflection, I can’t say you’re wrong. At this point, WorldCon has fully declared they don’t support free speech and they stand four-square for censorship and deplatforming.

        I’d boycott them harder, but 100% is all I got. Maybe I’ll start going after their suppliers and bankers. “Dear sir, as your company does business with WorldCon, I cannot in good concience continue to use your services…” etc.

        Hey, if they can do it to Baen…

        1. Agreed, don’t worry about boycotting all you have to do is start calling and writing to complain to their sponsors and banking systems. I dont want these rules but im getting closer to playing by them.

          1. I’m old and lazy. I don’t want to be bothered with this.

            But they are making it look more and more like a survival thing to me. Keep a life-jacket in the boat kind of thing.

        2. It is worse than that, Mr. Phantom.

          They’ve decided that abusing generous, capable, peacemaking family members is *desirable* if it lets them fornicate with Wokerati soibois. “Free speech” isn’t even in their rear view mirror.

          I’ll grant Mr. Correia was right: I took a dim view of Mrs. Weisskopf’s decision when I heard of it, but … Not my circus. I did not know that she was family, that these were her people.

          Blessed are the peacemakers, and good on Mrs. Weisskopf for doing the Old School girl thing. IRL we need people like this.

          World Con on the other hand…


          1. I didn’t know the story either, but I respect anyone who can bury the hatchet (and yes, I will continue to use that and other phrases!). Making peace takes humility and the willingness to put others (in the case, the company, authors, and fans) before yourself. That that the con people would do this to her is despicable.

            I was never a con person but was involved in similar groups, I know how it can be when they become toxic. If your company, and the livelihood of your staff and authors, depends on pleasing or at least not antagonizing a vocal, aggressive, toxic group of people bent on destruction… I can’t even imagine how hard that must be. Anyone who knows her, please tell her that!!!

          1. Yes, Jason Cordova. I thought that was clear. I guess it didn’t go where I meant it to?

            His comment in regards to Toni (not the sparkling kitchen) that is.

            Oddly I didn’t get any notification of this reply, someone else called it out to me.

          2. ShadowDancer, haven’t had reply notifications for awhile- is that something you’d like to see come back?

      2. Sadly, I have to agree. I think the time for “we’re better than that” has passed.

        At this stage accepting a Hugo award, or even a nomination, should be considered akin to getting an award from Kim Jong Un or Ayatollah Khamenei.

        I will no longer purchase any books written by any author who wins, or is nominated for, a Hugo Award and fails to decline said award or nomination.

        I will no longer purchase any books written by any author who attends this so-called “World”con, or who participates in its activities in any way, including as a supporting member.

        Now, the first part of that is probably weak sauce, as I rarely purchase the Hugo winners anyway (because they, like, you know… suck. Yeah, they do. They have for over 20 years now — the 2000 Worldcon was the last one that had more than one worthy entry for Best Novel). However, I know there are still a fair number of genuine authors who keep attending “World”con in the hope that the Kommunist Kiddie Kaffeeklatsch will eventually grow up or wander off and get lost or something. Clearly that’s not going to happen. They’re in full control, and by attending you’re enabling their behavior. It’s time to stop doing that. They’re not going to stop running purges, and eventually they’re going to get around to you. Why wait? Leave now and avoid the rush!

        Surely sharing an award (not to mention a physical space) with the likes of Booger TicTac can’t be that enticing? You know, he of the two Hugo Awards and author- or editorship of multiple “books” that are down in the mid-millions “floating turd” section of Amazon Sales Rank? The one who starts hyperventilating if someone forgets to call him “xim” or whatever the fuck it is.

        1. This is where I am with this.

          I’m at a point in my life when I’m pretty comfortable in my tastes: there’s a moderately-sized set of authors whose work I read regularly, and I don’t do a *ton* of experimental reading beyond that. So if I restricted my book-buying further, I doubt anybody would much notice.

          But I’m nevertheless perfectly happy to treat *any* association with WorldCon from this day forward as a proverbial mark of the beast.

          To hell with every last one of these contemptible pieces of human garbage.

        2. “If you participate in any future Worldcon you are propagating a system of misogyny, racism, and anti-Semitism.”

          Sick the death eaters – pardon me – the ADL – on them.

          Gander sauce.

          1. Ya’ll on crack. Like any award given by, ya know, people, it’s not perfect, but pretending like the books listed are universally awful is rediculous.

            Redshirts? Ancillary Justice? Three-body-problem? Those are fantastic unique books.

          2. 2013: Redshirts: A Novel with Three Codas, John Scalzi (Tor) beat Captain Vorpatril’s Alliance, Lois McMaster Bujold (Baen)

            That was a “oh my God, you people have to be kidding” year. And Sad Puppies 1.

            Sad Puppies 2 struck in 2015, getting Warbound, Book III of the Grimnoir Chronicles, Larry Correia (Baen Books) nominated.

            Sad Puppies 3 introduced me to good works and authors I hadn’t read before.

            Since then?

            All trash

          3. “Redshirts” had potential, kind of a “Star Trek meets Hitchhikers” self aware parody. Then Scalzi tried to do a Profound PKD kind of twist thing, and utterly failed. Which didn’t stop him from getting the Smugs about How Clever He Is.

          4. Holy crap, I had no idea that frigging Scalzi beat out BUJOLD, who is a master of the genre, and has very, very few books I don’t like. (I don’t know what was going on with Gentleman Jole.) Captain Vorpatril’s Alliance is one of her best.

            That’s just…that says so much, right there, in a nutshell.

          5. Redshirts? REDSHIRTS? Dude, that wasn’t even the best Star Trek fanfic of the year, much less the best overall SF novel.

            Dreckie’s pap is a pseudointellectual “literary” one-trick pony rehashing themes that were done better 40-50 years ago, though I must admit it’s somewhat amusing to watch a woman who is whiter than Edgar Winter’s underballs being hailed as an icon of “diversity”.

          6. Redshirts won because it was a novel-length treatment of a long-standing fannish joke. The novel itself was completely forgettable, although I thought one of the codas was actually quite good.

            Ancillary Justice is what happens when a writer takes to heart the advice to grab the reader early with some action. After the first chapter, I read the rest of the book waiting, in vain, for something interesting to happen. It had an interesting premise: what happens when a distributed mind goes to war with itself, but it didn’t go anywhere with the idea, preferring instead to play games with pronouns.

            What was the last book? Oh, yes the Three Body Problem. I thought it was a good read, but I’ve never read a more depressing story. The superpowerful aliens are coming because the human race was betrayed by ourselves. Us humans are not going to survive and we deserve not to because those aliens are better than us in every possible way.

        3. Thank you for this comment

          Because you caused me to go back and check the lists. As others have pointed out, there were good years since then. But the big thing for me was I discovered “The Cookie Monster” by Vernor Vinge (2004 Hugo Best Novelette), which is a great story.

          So thanks for making me look 🙂

          1. Redshirts is one of the worst books I have ever read in my entire life. Smug, smarmy, joyless spit take. The scowling hipster cousin of Galaxy Quest.

            Only thing by Scalzi I read that was worse was his slaughter of Piper’s Fuzzyverse.

  5. Once upon a time, I regarded Worldcon as being to SF fandom what the Dayton Hamvention is to ham radio, or EAA’s Airventure in Oshkosh is to aviation: the biggest, most exciting, best event in the field, to which every fan should aspire to go at least once in a well-lived life.

    I’ve been to Dayton.
    I’ve been to Oshkosh.

    I have no interest whatsoever in going to Worldcon.

      1. Absolutely. The scale and the variety means it never gets boring. One attendee happily showed me around his recently completed 1910 Curtiss, (found in a crate after a century) and his was just one of a great many stories.

      2. Oh, yeah. Every aviation geek needs to go to Oshkosh at least once. Do yourself a favor and join EAA first: the discount at the gate pretty much pays for it.

    1. I got to go to a few WorldCons before they totally went off the rails. Got to hang out with friends, do techy stuff with TechnoFandom, meet some of my favorite authors (yep, back when they were still invited to WorldCons…) and generally enjoyed myself. Then life got more complicated to the point where I hardly got to ANY cons any more. And now I am looking back and considering those events to be an odd sort of blessing, because I didn’t have to BE THERE for the accelerating demise of what once was a wonderful thing.

      1. It used to be so much fun.

        Never forget the 5th Iowa Hawk Corollary.

        And when it is stinking and crawling with maggots, convince everyone it was always this foul.

  6. I’ve been reading SF for over 50 years so I selfishly just want good stories, like Gun Runner. I may not like all the books I buy, but I love that authors produce them for me to choose from.

    I’m very grateful for people who write these stories, and have nothing but distain for the mob, trying to destroy hard working Authors, their fans, and publishers.

    Normal people read what they like and ignore the rest.

    These self obsessed idiots think that their ideas are the only ones worthwhile and are willing to kill and destroy to make sure people don’t have choices.

    I want choices. Screw them.

    Great Rant!

  7. Lucy pulled the football again on Charlie Brown? Like we didn’t see that coming.

    The “old time fans” at WorldCon just want to have their fun without any of the uproar and controversy that comes along with inviting one of “those people” to their party. I mean, they try to be all inclusive and wonderful about everything you know, but then some sock-puppet turns up on Baen’s Bar, and then all the pearl-clutching begins, and really it’s all a bit too much for an old mobility-scooter-rider to be dealing with.

    Just ban the disgraceful haterz and be done with it, right? Seriously, they don’t deserve any better.

    Meanwhile, all the Usual Suspects are defending John Del Arroz and trying to justify why Free Speech is too dangerous to let just anyone have it. Failing, of course, but still trying.

    Getting to be time for Charlie Brown to tell Lucy to shove that ball where the sun don’t shine.

    1. I’m mindful of one Con, which made a big deal about being “safe for everyone” then invited Chuck Wendig, who was such an abusive figure from the left that even the very left wing Marvel Comics fired him for it.

      1. He wasn’t ‘abusive’ in the way they are against, most likely (and no, Marvel Comics is not ‘very left wing’, just liberal like it’s always been.)

    2. Although, banning JDA from World Con on an excuse was beyond idiotic and totally uncalled for. It was playing 100% into the idea that the mere fact that someone is walking down a convention hallway and breathing the same air “harms” people. (That goes the same for people who are his partisans or those who think he’s a dick.)

      Same language was in posts and comments about Toni, official ones, iirc. Would her attendance “harm” other attendees just because they knew she was there?

      Apparently without actually even involving a hotel or a hallway with garrish carpet. Efficiency!

      Any of the old SMOFs and “venerable” authors should seriously consider if they want to lend their time to Zoom panels of this fiasco.

      1. I am both a JDA partisan/friend, and also think he’s got a serious dick quotient, probably from being tainted by Commiefornia (something in the water/air/food?). JDA didn’t deserve any of the treatment he got, neither does Toni. WorldCon “people” ( staff, whatever we want to call them) Clearly have no honor, integrity, courage, or any other virtues as we know them. They also clearly don’t believe in, subscribe to, or support freedom as we know it.

        1. It was LARPing oppression and outrage.

          I’ve met Jon and his wife. They are perfectly amiable people in person at a convention. That doesn’t change because people are upset at each other. We shouldn’t lose the ability to be civil or social with people, even with those we don’t *like*.

          But that’s what the idiotic woke are demanding, and *pretending* to expect. They’re LARPing a scenario where the presence of “enemies” is going to send them into puddles of anxiety and horror. Particularly if the “enemy” appears to be having a good time.

  8. Out hear in the heart of America there is a RAGE growing. I HATE these fucking woke monsters, and I’m a Christian and I know I’m not supposed to, but the absolute torrential fire hose of abuse being pointed at us leaves me unable to be gracious anymore.

    If they keep this up they will get the Civil War they so think they’ll win.

    So now I just say BRING IT. We’ll go to war with you fuckers, because you won’t leave us the hell alone, and that’s all we ever really wanted.

    So as Breitbart noted long ago. FUCK YOU. WAR.

    1. God bless you, Larry. Excellent words, as usual. You gave them more credit for having a conscience (or conscious) than I would have at this point.

      And hats off to Toni for having more faith in them than most of us would. I’m just sorry they proved her faith was misplaced where they are concerned.

    2. If they keep this up they will get the Civil War they so think they’ll win.

      A lot of them think they’ve already won it. They think that joke at the Capitol was all the opposition they will ever need to face.

      Remember that.

      1. Yes, I used to think calling that an “insurrection” was a cynical joke — “Let’s see how many people we can get to think a ginned-up crowd of agitators, wackos, and excitable people who got carried away and we LET IN to take selfies (the normal ones), prance around in costumes (the wackos) and smear feces on the wall (the agitators) are the same as an insurrection if we say it enough times!” — and I still think a lot of the pols, at least, did this. But after weeks have gone by, I really think a lot of people believe that was an insurrection and that they “put it down.” This is frightening on more than one level.

        I don’t want a real insurrection. They seem to want one. I think the people in charge know very well what it would take to put down a real one, and are prepared to do it. But I also think a lot of their supporters are idiots and think this is all that could ever happen and they did a super-great job at ending it. If this attitude keeps everyone cowed, as they hope it will, it was a winning strategy for them. But if it backfires it could be horrific.

        1. Disagree in part.

          It isn’t that the Prog-tots want an insurrection…

          … it’s that most have *no idea* what they are asking for, no clue how ugly their little games can get, not even an inkling of how nations fall.

          This doesn’t excuse them or their behavior.

          This does offer a different tactic for peeling off some of their support.

          Not enough to stop the now-inevitable, but maybe enough to tweak the schedule to a better time and place. (see: Sun Tzu)


      1. It’s like summoning Biggie Smalls. Say his name three times quickly into your computer screen and he’ll appear, first attacking you, then demanding you apologize to him, then begging you to come on his livestream.

          1. Whatever he and his thousand pairs of socks get up to in the privacy of his own living room is none of my business…

            …. but the great hall of Chateau ILoH is not the hack’s living room, now is it?


      1. No, no, man. Those randos praising him were totally different, actual human beings who did that spontaneously and of their own volition. How dare you!

        He even made a meme about it on Twitter and pretended one of his “fans” made the meme for him.

        He has many imaginary friends.

        1. I know for a fact that at least one was real. Because I know the person who posted it.


          What could Mr. Del Arroz do to optimize his behavior. Specifically. And why? I mean, aside from one’s feelings (irritation, etc) what is the real world gain for you and yours? And what responses should we (you, other people) make to him that would get you on the same page? What is in it for him?

          Of course this assumes you are not in fact enemies out to destroy one another as the Wokistas and the SJWs are to us*.

          (*And I really just want them to repent, grow up, and quit making the world in general, and my communities in particular messier, uglier, and more dangerous. I wonder if any of them think that way, too about me?)

          1. What could Mr. Del Arroz do to optimize his behavior. Specifically.

            While I can’t answer that for myself, not being one of the people whom he’s angered by his behavior, several of them posted responses to his comment here:


            Reading that comment thread would give you a pretty good idea of what behavior he could be optimizing (as you put it), because the people who are mad at him gave specific examples of why they’re mad at him.

            As I said, I don’t have a dog in this fight; I’m just answering your question since I happened to have read that thread recently enough that I still remembered where to find it.

          2. There is no “us” here. Jon Del Arroz is not involved in this. His presence has not been requested and is not required. Him being on “the team” offers zero benefit to Larry or anyone at Baen. What do you think he’s going to do, exactly? Tweet more? Photoshop some more memes? Engage in more online harassment?

            How does that help Larry? How does that help Baen? He’s just trying to glom onto this in an effort to boost his own career and everyone knows it.

            I now have multiple friends that he’s attacked, insulted, or harassed, and it’s always the same schtick: talk shit, get defensive when confronted, then whine that “we’re on the same team” when told to get lost. Shit-talk people in public then privately approach them and say “we should be friends” (just like Nicki Haley).

            This isn’t about politics. It isn’t about the SJWs. It isn’t “cancel culture.” He’s on the outs because he repeatedly and unapologetically acted like a giant jackass. He showed up here and publicly insulted both Larry and Toni. He came back despite being asked to leave.

            Nobody is victimizing him- he brought all of this on himself.

            Nobody owes him a response. Larry has made it clear that he doesn’t care what “page” Jon is on. He just needs to let this shit go and get on with his life.

          3. At this point the best course of action would be to stop talking about him. He is lurking here and feeding off of every comment that invokes his name. Siphoning time and energy that could be directed towards helping Mrs Weisskopf.

            Her kind of courage can be very lonely. Let her know she is not alone.

      2. Hi Larry,

        Late comment, because I’m always late. It’s a feature not a bug.

        I engaged with the Twitter mob, because reasons, and was told I write ‘fascist US civil war fanfic,’ which ended any chance of a sensible discourse with said fans of Ann L who blocked me after I said, ‘Don’t be part of the problem, be part of the solution.’

        When we met, we talked about the left v right thing, but we could still talk because both of us were happy to talk. Now it seems that unless the talking is agreement, no one wants to take a step back and cool down.

        The hotheads have won.

      1. He was my very first block on MeWe. Every other hour or so was a new post on CLFA (closed group formerly on FB; Conservative-Libertarian Fiction Alliance) about how put-upon he is because he’s banned from one person’s personal blog, calling it “cancel culture” even though no one has done shit about removing him from any of his other methods to communicate with others.

        In one of the early threads I even tried to get the point across that others have mentioned here, on how he was his own worse enemy, but in the end I ran out of fucks to give, and I didn’t have that many to start with.

  9. That was a beautiful fuck you, Larry. You know I don’t say much on my main FB page other than posting a random photo of one of my animals, but I’m so fucking incensed right now… Thanks for putting into words what I’m feeling right now. Because at this point, I’m just uttering random F-bombs.

  10. Well said.

    I started buying Baen Bundles a year ago because I needed an escape from the events of 2020, at least for a couple of hours a day. So I’ve read just about everything published by Baen in that period of time, along with some older stuff. Even the books in sub-genres I don’t normally enjoy were entertaining.

    So if WorldCon now disapproves of what Baen stands for (see Toni’s statement from the other day) or publishes because of some bullshit hit-piece, then I want no part of either WorldCon or the supporters (who will no doubt helpfully reveal themselves on social media for brownie points) of its cowardly act. If that’s the message they wanted to deliver, then consider it received.

  11. “I’ve heard more subversive conversations recently at my local small town grocery store between literal grandmas than that.”


    I’m undecided as to whether they’re just that overconfident that they’ve got everything set and everyone outmaneuvered, or if they’re really that stupid. They keep pushing, they’re NOT going to like what’s going to happen.

    But it’s coming, because I don’t think they know how to stop.

    1. Most addicts can’t stop… something outside themselves has to stop them … often it’s down to the grim reaper. I’m given to understand he’s not happy about it, but that’s beside the point.

      A house divided against itself cannot stand.


      1. Agreed. What most regular people don’t seem to get is that there’s a certain subset of the population that is addicted to sadism and cruelty.

        It’s like serial killers; they’re sane enough not to do it when they think they’ll get caught. But if they’ve got you alone, or overpowered, or especially declared “not our kind, dear” so everyone will think you deserved it? Hold onto your hat, you can’t get them to stop short of physical violence. Sometimes not even then.

    2. “I’ve heard more subversive conversations recently at my local small town grocery store between literal grandmas than that.”

      Hell — I’ve heard more subversive conversations recently at my local Safeway than that. In California….

      In the SF Bay Area.

      That’s right. Smack dab in the middle of “Left of Lenin land.” More subversive conversations between literal grandmas who are totally fed up with left-ish virtue signaling and the whole woke thing. And when some woke scolds started in on them, a wide variety of random shoppers told the scolds that they should be ashamed of themselves and should get lost. Immediately.

      You could have knocked me over with a feather!

    3. “Just wait until they start to bother the people who just want to be left alone.”

      That’s not my quote, but I have used it repeatedly, especially in my new neighborhood where I just moved, and every single person that I have said that to has replied with a resounding “that is so true.”

      We just want to be left alone. But if the “woke” mob wants to poke us in the eye, the response is NOT going to go their way.

      We just want to be left alone.

  12. What’s really sad, is that ***none*** of this surprises me. This blog entry, of course, will be ridiculed on China Mike’s Bot Farm, in about 5 nanoseconds.

    And people wonder why I haven’t been to a con in this century…

    1. Back at Spokane Worldcon L. Jagi got insulted to her face by one of the ‘notable’ guests. Jagi!
      And now they do similar to Toni.
      Hang them all. Eviscerate their bodies. Burn them.
      Then do it all over again.

      1. Not just a guest, but her editor, who also happens to be a strong advocate of the idiotic “punching down” theory.

        Because nothing says “punching up” like a powerful male editor berating a female mid-list author, am I right?

        1. “For what? Why would anyone insult her?”
          Why do bullies exist in the first place? Especially if one can justify that bullying as being part of a Noble Cause.

      1. I don’t think it’s fixed yet; I had another comment disappear unposted just now. It was a response to Codex’s 6:18 AM comment.

        I hope this comment posts; I’ve noticed the problem seems to be time-based somehow, so that multiple comments I post within an hour or so of each other all disappear (and then eventually they all show up, presumably because you found them stuck in a moderation queue and released them). So it’s possible that this comment won’t post either.

        1. I got internet back last night- I’ve been manually approving until I could get under the hood. Fingers crossed it’s hopefully fixed now.
          (This comment is at least partially so I can test it- I was getting moderated too!)

  13. Right there with ya on the quislings, Larry. People who are too damned cowardly to stand up and say anything, but slink to the back of the room to agree with you are the worst. I have zero respect for the smarmy, weak wannabes.

  14. Why would I want to attend a convention which is filled with a bunch of people who hate me and the things I stand for?
    Sorry, no giving money to people who want to kill me, either directly or indirectly.

  15. I’m pissed as hell about what they just did, but I can’t really pontificate on it too much right now.

    Let’s just say anything I said would likely be used against someone else in the future.

    Instead, I’ll happily tell that whole crowd to go fuck themselves with a flying, rusty chainsaw slathered in Carolina reaper juice.

  16. I don’t think I’ve ever been angrier for anyone as I am for Ms. Weisskopf. BAEN has been a lifeline for me over the years, with the Free Library and book bundles. I discovered so many authors through BAEN. This is totally outrageous.

    1. Toni is a much better person than I am.

      I was surprised that WordCon still existed. Not so much that they are still utter morons with the personality and wit of 12 year old mean girls and less common sense than baby ducklings.

      I will keep buying books I like, from authors I like. The Smofs can keep their little convention of fools until it burns down around their ears. Toni Weiskopf has a better idea of what readers want and how to run a business than they do. They could have learned a lot from Toni.

  17. I knew Toni Weisskopf was an editor/publisher. I didn’t know she had been a BNF in her youth. Most BNF s are completely unknown 20 miles away from their hometowns.

    I have been to two Worldcons in my life. Enjoyed both. Unless my writing improves enough to be nominated for a Hugo or Nebula I don’t expect to attend a third one. Too expensive, unless you’re a guest.

    1. “Unless my writing improves enough to be nominated for a Hugo or Nebula”

      If your writing gets Hugo nominated: …Stop writing!

    2. Im just a lowly reader. But I usually look at the books that get such awards as something to miss. Kind of like movies that have perfect 100% from critics. Usually awful.

    1. Of course he will. And now maybe after a decade of being a wannabe poser some woke publisher will toss him a pity contract.

      1. Indeed, I suspect that was the intend of his vacuous screed….”LOOK AT MEEEE! I’M MORE WOKE THAN YOUUUUU!”. I suggest he be invited to LibertyCon as GoH and be immediately put in stocks for the duration. I’d be glad to bring the rotten vegetables. No I’m not looking for a ticket to the Con….I’d be happy handing out veggies while standing out front.

        1. This sounds like a great educational presentation.

          Who gets the educatin’ is left as an exercise for the veggie vendors.

    2. I called that a few days ago. He might also get nominated for some pidling fiction he had come out last year (which, I feel, this was also directed to garner attention for).

      1. Jason Cordova, when I first saw this guy I had a brain fart like “wait don’t I know of him and he’s a nice guy?” Then realized I was actually thinking of you!

        1. @Kate: I’ve had a few people go “wait, Cordova said… oh, some other Jason”.

          Protip — he’s white and identifies as a victim. I’m Hispanic and identify as an American.

  18. Well said. And hopefully this is the FINAL nail in the coffin of WC and the Hugos. They deserve to die by drowning in the river of shit they have spawned.

  19. I’d hate for others of the same name to get mistaken for the actual shit-weasel in question (and apologies to actual shit-weasels for the comparison, they can’t help it) so I think I’ll just refer to him by his complete job title from now on.

    The hit piece on Baen/Toni was done by Jason Sanford, Manager of Communications and Content for the Ohio News Media Association, in a stunning dislpay of a complete lack of journalistic ethics, or ethics of any sort whatsoever..

    1. “Manager of Communications and Content for the Ohio News Media Association” is the parasite’s actual JOB?!
      The bar for media employment seems to be set very low — competence in leftism is apparently the hiring qualities they desire.

    2. Be a shame if people complained to his boss about his lack of ethics and/or sloppiness in twisting his “reporting” in order to get a publisher shut down.

      1. His boss would probably give him Employee of the Month for that.

        Sorry, I’ve known too many ‘mainstream’ journalists in my time. Their principal job is to suppress the news, or if that is not feasible, to lie about it.

    3. [WKRP] Five-time winner of the coveted Silver Sow Award, the trophy for which is a sculpture of an extremely large white communist woman in a mobility scooter. [/WKRP]

      Yeah, a cheap shot. Sorry…but I couldn’t resist.

  20. Reading that, finished off with the signature “Larry F. Correia”, I now have it in my headspace that the F stands for “F***in’”.

    Bravo. It is necessary for people to stand up. We are lucky to have you, Larry

  21. The first convention I attended was Chicon 7. I watched Ursula Vernon accept her Hugo for Digger. I had a good time there and even managed to miss catching ‘con crud’. That was the last halfway decent World con. When I went to the NASFIC in Detroit, the wokeness was getting to be too much for me. I have not supported Worldcon since then. One of these years, I hope to be able to attend Liberty Con and Dragon Con, unless the wokeness kills them, too.

    1. Over on MeWe on the MHI group I asked what peoples’ thoughts were on Dragon Con, was it still a “good” con or was it going “woke” and getting unpleasant. I’m going to re-post a reply in toto here:

      “David Butler –
      Dragon Con tries to keep politics out of the con. For its trouble, it gets labeled Right Wing. That’s nonsense. Dragon Con is Nerd Carnival. I’ll be there.”

      So, one hopes, the Dragon Con folks continue to stand firm and not fall victim to the SJW mob and either start with the “ooo, we can’t invite this person, they said something nasty about someone 12.33yrs ago on their MySpace page when they were 12,” or just fold up the tent and go home to avoid the whole thing…

      1. A couple of years ago, after other cons had invited, and then disinvited me and John Ringo, some Social Justice Harpy started an online crusade to get me and Ringo booted from Dragon. One of the DC track heads jumped in and was all about getting me and Ringo kicked…
        As soon as it came to DragonCon’s attention this was happening, they were all like, oh fuck no. And they shut it the hell down. The volunteer is no longer at DC, and they have since invited me as a guest of honor. DC wanted no part of that woke mob nonsense.

        1. Well then, time for me to figure out how to budget for Dragon Con yearly instead of every-other-year like we planned!

        2. Unfortunately, the last time I attended DragonCon (2019), it felt as though it was heading toward the left, 90% of the panels seemed to cater toward the WOKE crowd. I decided then that I’d limit myself the libertyCon.

  22. The first convention I attended was Chicon 7. I watched Ursula Vernon accept her Hugo for Digger. I had a good time there and even managed to miss catching ‘con crud’. That was the last halfway decent World con. When I went to the NASFIC in Detroit, the wokeness was getting to be too much for me. I have not supported Worldcon since then. One of these years, I hope to be able to attend Liberty Con and Dragon Con, unless the wokeness kills them, too.

  23. Larry, I’m concerned… You really shouldn’t bottle up your feelings like that… Let it all out and tell us how you REALLY feel… You’re liable to explode at this rate!

  24. Well said. As I told someone earlier who asked my opinion, I think as a 15 year veteran, former Merchant Mariner, and child of two veterans, I still lack the full vocabulary to properly express my opinion on the subject.

  25. I’ve been studiously avoiding anything to do with “Worldcon” for several years now. However, I clicked over to their page from the MHI Facebook group and was highly amused to see that a whopping 285 Hugo nomination votes have been received so far.

    A mighty force, that “Worldcon”.

    Personally, I’d be ashamed to use a name that grandiose for a convention with lower attendance than Bronycon (which was actually scrapped due to low attendance), but these types are always legends in their own minds.

    1. Yep. The people who get 285 total nominations (supposedly to represent all the fans on Earth) were super shocked when I showed up with 286 friends. (it was actually a lot more than that, but I don’t remember numbers now. But they used to be bigger back then too. They’re dwindling into obscurity).

        1. I’m glad you’re continuing to call it the Campbell Award. Every time you do that, an SJW’s blood pressure goes up 20 or 30 points.

          1. I got nominated for a Campbell for best new writer. Not some bullshit whatever they’re calling it now award.

      1. I was at the Spokane Worldcon, and spent a lot of time in the consuite (because, hey, free food is great when you have a small child.) They had prime rib one night, even. Somebody asked the guy in charge how they could afford such great food, and he shrugged and said, “Honestly? Thank Vox Day.”

        I deliberately avoided the awards ceremony, and I wasn’t the only one. It soured a lot of otherwise great fun for me. (Mostly in the filk room. Maybe I should start looking into filk cons.)

        1. Don’t. Filk is as woke as any other part and maybe more. I was in the filk world, once. Take it from personal experience, you really don’t want to go there now.

          1. Filk was my first heartache when I discovered science fiction conventions. I went to one at BayCon which was fun (and huge) and then later I went to one at a smaller local convention and discovered that while a few songs were fun poking at science fiction and fantasy tropes, several others were “Christians are icky” and “lets mock conservatives to the tune of Jingle Bells.”

            I mean, WTF?

            I LOVE sing alongs. They are exactly “my thing.” But I never went to one of them again.


      2. Looking for the numbers….

        In 2013, the threshold for a best novel nomination was 118 votes (Saladin Ahmed). The lowest number of nominations for a ballot finalist was 26. Overall, says there were 1343 nominating ballots.

        In 2015 (Sad & rabid Puppies), 2122 nominating ballots. Threshold for best novel was 210; low number of nominations was 23.

        In 2020, 1339 nominating ballots; lowest best novel nominee appeared on 99 ballots.

        1. Yep. It was when I got the results back after my Campbell nom that I was blown away by how incredibly tiny and insular this whole MOST IMPORTANT AWARD THAT REPRESENTS ALL FANDOM actually was. I’d grown up thinking it actually meant something.

          1. At $40 for a supporting membership (in 2015), buying yourself the title “Hugo Award nominated writer” would typically cost between $1300-$5000 (the latter for novels).

            And easy to disguise those purchases as “we’re sponsoring all our employees and authors to participate”.

  26. Larry, your Ranty McRants are the best.

    Every time I get a nugget for my Big Book O’ Quotes. With attribution , of course.

    Thanks for this.

  27. You know that guy who has a cart in the walkway of your local mall with the “Have Your Name Inscribed on a Grain of Rice” banner? I want to hire him to transcribe this rant onto a box full of 230-grain FMJ’s.

    Will they provide extra protection against Internet Shit Gibbons? Maybe, maybe not…..but it can’t hurt.

  28. I’m in a quandary here. I don’t know the people on the other side of this(IMO the wrong side). However, I’ve read over 20 of Larry’s posts and I agree and appreciate every one.
    Thank You Larry Correia for standing up and speaking your mind.
    I have read a lot of books and stories from Baen publishing. The great majority of them entertaining and enjoyable. I’ve found many authors because of Baen. Thank You Jim Baen. In my opinion, Toni Weisskopf has carried on Mr. Baen’s legacy without a hitch.
    Ms. Weisskopf you deserve to be the Guest of Honor at a lot of venues.
    Please keep up the incredible work you do.

  29. “Anyone who provides a venue with sufficient freedom of speech that people whom we severely disagree with are allowed, is second-degree radioactive and must be shunned.” —Discon III (translated)

  30. The real problem is that there are no surprises…. A shit weasel ‘exposes’ our twenty year old conversations… about a totally different time and society…. and the Social Justice Bullies respond in the only way they know.
    It’s so bad that I’m angry as hell, so sorry that Toni has to put up with this just because she was too nice to spurn an olive branch, and actually want to laugh as how important the shit weasel and WorldCon think they are in Fandom…

    My emotions are going six ways at once right now.

    They still can’t get enough attendance to match a signing line for the authors they’re dismissing… and don’t individually have the sales numbers to prove the fans appreciate them in the only way that truly counts… voting with their dollars…

    When I remember how badly they burned their own house down to keep from letting REAL fans decide awards it gives me a warm feeling..

    They really didn’t need to do this to remind the world what a shitshow they’ve become… but it’s actually kinda the right time for people to be reminded and the new folks informed just what kind of folks they are dealing with here.

  31. Funny how you expected some level of respect from a group that gave out wooden asshole awards to Baen authors last year.

    I’m glad they did this. Toni and everyone one of you need to realize that these people aren’t interested in getting along with you and that they want to destroy you. Not just your career or business, they want to destroy your soul, if they believed in it.

    Toni bet her knee to the SJW horde and this is how the horde responds. Let that be a lesson. Stop playing nice, stop trying to make inroads, make your own cons and your own platforms.

  32. Some fen have a different opinion on the matter. The National Fantasy Fan Federation, founded 1941, gives annual awards, the Neffys. Please note

    2015 Best Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2016 Best Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2017 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2018 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2019 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2020 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf

    Our members have good taste. Please consider joining us, the N3F. Non-voting memberships are free, and get you all nine of our fanzines.

  33. Some fen have a different opinion on the matter. The National Fantasy Fan Federation, founded 1941, gives annual awards, the Neffys. Please note

    2015 Best Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2016 Best Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2017 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2018 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2019 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf
    2020 Best Book Editor Toni Weisskopf

    Our members have good taste. Please consider joining us, the N3F. Non-voting memberships are free, and get you all nine of our fanzines.

  34. It wasn’t until about mid 2001 that I realized what was going on with Sci-fi. I LOVED Heinlein and the other classic authors when I discovered them in 8th grade, mid to late 80’s. As I ran out of the classics, I tried more recently copyrighted material, and noticed that as it entered the 90’s, it became less and less enjoyable. The further into the 90’s it got, it was, by and large, less and less enjoyable, and more and more obviously a vessel to deliver a message.

    It didn’t click with me until about mid 2001, as I stated above, that the authors that I continued to enjoy, mostly shared a common publisher. At this point, I have effectively been filtering by publisher first for almost two decades. This is yet another brick in the wall, if I might use the simile, in my determination to continue to behave in this manner.

    Yes, I’m just one guy. And one customer is unlikely to affect a publisher’s bottom line. However, it should be noted that the last time I moved, I shipped my books by media mail, thanks to the USPS. I filled over 30 boxes with books. The vast majority of the sci fi books said BAEN somewhere on the cover.

    This is why.

    Because BAEN is about printing great stories, not printing what the loudest complainers want to see in print. Weber, Flint, Ringo, Hoyt, Lackey, Correia or any other new or old author, I don’t care what their political stance or opinion is, I want to read good stories.

    1. “Yes, I’m just one guy. ”


      No sir, you are not just one guy. You, my good sir, are part of a mighty Brotherhood. Many of us have basements filled with Baen books. I used to have many other publishers, but by about 2005 it was down to Baen and I didn’t even notice what was happening.

      By 2010 it was down to five or six authors, our host being one of them. But none of those authors write fast enough to keep a five-book-every-week. So about 2014, I started writing my own damn books. (If you’re interested to see the results, you can google “Edward Thomas Unfair Advantage” and read the Amazon blurb.)

      But that’s what’s happening in the genre. The Brotherhood is leaving, and the SJWs are calling it a “victory”. I left to make my own, what the rest of y’all are doing I’m not sure. ~:D

      Reading Manga and watching anime, if the cons are any indication. Niagara Falls Ontario Comic Con is a bigger deal than WorldCon ever was. Niagara Falls is a backwater.

      1. You are not alone, and we are within 2 years of age. I looked through my book shelf for those bought in last 20 years. I have 18 different Baen authors, I’m not counting how many books. And 13 total tor books ,10 are the Weber Safehold series and 3 from Ender. Then 15 from Butcher that I can’t remember the publisher and I’m too lazy to walk down and see who it is as I have no other books from said publisher. I’m allowed to “suggest “ 1 book a month from my library. I think that is the only reason they have a decent selection of books, that all seem to be from the same publisher

  35. I posted a small piece on Sandfart a few days ago,

    And this showed up in my comments.

    It was from one Matthew Hopkins, and he’s been digging into the walking diaper stain. He’s been reaching out to the two legged turd’s employers and politely, (underline polite), asking them to review what this male clone of lie-a-watha Warren wrote.

    It has lots of nice contact information. Per his request, if you do use the information, please, please be polite and professional. The goal is to help Ms. Weisskopf.

    1. If that’s who I think it is, be careful about dealing with him.

      He’s got a bit of a rep as being a looney and getting into silly slapfights online.

      Any chair in a bar fight and all that, but make sure it’s not a chair that’s going to fall apart on you.

    2. I suspect that “employer” is himself, and his real job is either WalMart or “stay at home husband,” who doesn’t actually do anything.

      1. The Ohio News Media thing is a real organization, that mostly exists to give awards for local reporting and send out newsletters. He has an office job, and is one of its few employees. No idea if it is a full time job.

  36. Any ideas on reprisals? I just sent the hotel hosting Worldcon an e-mail stating that I will never stay there again. I will be talking to my employer Monday on having it removed from our list of approved places to stay.

    1. You gotta pair a carrot with the stick.

      Don’t just say “I’ll never stay there again and get you blacklisted for our Fortune 100 company”, say that with “if you continue to host WorldCon”.

      The former just says there’s no point in trying to placate you. The latter says they might get something on exchange. And really, the goal would be to fuck with WorldCon, not some random hotel.

      1. Worldcon goes to a different city every year. I don’t know what the rotation is now, but there used to be a 3 year rotation for West, Center, East US, and generally a “no more than once every 3 cycles for an area”

        So no one will be trying to hold another Chicago worldcon for 9+ years.

        OTOH, there are cons held every year in Chicago. Look up who’s running the Chicago WC this year, find out what other Chicago Cons they’re part of, and target THOSE Cons with the Hotels.

        Note: in the late 1990s, Seattle had a bid going for the 2002 Worldcon. They got in a fight with the big hotel they needed (which is to say they publicly released something pissy about the hotel).

        The Hotel told them to FOAD, and their bid went away.

        There’s a Seattle in 2025 organization, bidding with a hotel that opened in 2019. The last Seattle Worldcon was in 1961.

        SF Cons are bottom feeders. It shouldn’t take a lot to get hotels to not want anything to do, with any of the scumbag related cons

          1. Currently there is no zone requirement. It was done away with a long time ago because it had served its purpose of encouraging non-North American Worldcons and not burning out the locals on running a Worldcon.

            I had a much longer response, but the blog ate it.

  37. All it takes for a Cultural Revolution to kick off is for ‘good’ people to remain silent in the face of hatred.

    All those sending emails and ‘quietly bemoaning the cancer’? They’re why fascism happens.

    Good job.

    1. Yes, that is correct. I predicted that the 2030 WorldCon would be two fat old men meeting at a Denny’s in Pasedena, each one trying to vote the other off the Business Meeting.

      Recently, when that lady volunteer quit in disgust, I moved up my timeline to 2025. Today it’s looking like 2022 may be the year.

      1. On the bright side, the last man standing will probably be venal enough to sell the rights if we have a whip-around.

  38. I have to say my solution is to self publish and to not bother attending their communist struggle sessions where they’re looking for someone to ravage.

  39. BTW, a “Nebula nomination” is bullshit. When I was a member, it was common practice, so common they had pleads not to do it every month, that swapping endorsements with people was a dishonest approach.

    He wasn’t a finalist, or a winner. He was “nominated.” The nomination slate is literally hundreds of works, and you can get nominated with a dozen or so votes. Every year I’d get entire fucking crates of free books, photocopies of stories, business cards, promotions, looking for me to “nominate” someone.

  40. Let’s all agree to never speak of the Nebulas (and SFWA) or Hugos (and by extension WorldCon) ever again. They are pariah organizations run by overt racists and fascists.

    Doom them to final obscurity by never soiling conversation about them again. Treat them like the Furries of SF fandom.

    1. I’d rather hang out with furries than WorldCon staff. Furries are weird, but honestly weird. WorldCon pukes are just *vile*. Treacherous scum.

  41. What a despicable act by a once honored brand. Larry’s epic response puts into words what I feel about this. It helps.

  42. Larry, you have to stop holding it in and let us know how you really feel. The truly sad thing is you could have let loose and told us all the dirty little secrets of who has said what to you. You have more restraint than I will ever have. I would have launched in to naming names and quoting them. Hoist them on their own damn petard and let it all burn down around them.

  43. Well said.

    I started buying Baen Bundles a year ago because I needed an escape from the events of 2020, at least for a couple of hours a day. So I’ve read just about everything published by Baen in that period of time, along with some older stuff. Even the books in sub-genres I don’t normally enjoy were entertaining.

    So if WorldCon now disapproves of what Baen stands for (see Toni’s statement from the other day) or publishes because of some bullshit hit-piece, then I want no part of either WorldCon or the supporters (who will no doubt helpfully reveal themselves on social media for brownie points) of its cowardly act. If that’s the message they wanted to deliver, then consider it received.

  44. I’ll spell it out: WC and its awards were taken over by Tor’s editing staff back in the 1990s — most specifically by the N-Hs. Harlan Ellison called them out in an episode of _Sci-Fi Buzz_ back then: ….

    This is why I refer to the awards as “the Tor-gos” — instead of being named for a competent editor, it’s name for a retarded cripple who works for the forces of evil.

    1. My suspicion is that the loud virtue signaling, the purity witch hunts, and assorted tactics is just a smokescreen for turning the Hugos into something like the JD Power awards, a house brand participation trophy to fool the rubes that the item on sale is actually worth something.
      It’s backfired spectacularly, but they don’t really care that much.

    2. Hey now! I will not stand for such misrepresentation!

      ….Torgo was meant to be a goat man. They couldn’t afford the hooves so that’s why all one sees is the weird “big knees” ????

  45. I had already made the decision not to renew Amazon Prime. I was looking to spend the last of my gift card balance before Prime expiration. This article made it easy. I bought a bunch of your Baen-published books. I also used Amazon Smile so a portion goes to a pro-gunowner civil rights foundation in my state.

  46. Can’t say I am shocked at all. For most of the past decade, Worldcon has been shedding adults. Either because the true Old Fandom has been dying off. Or people have simply been walking out in disgust at the politics and nastiness. Or because they have been ejected by the Woke Children who’ve made it their business to turn Worldcon — and really, this is about the Hugos as much as anything — into a Woke megaphone.

    In 2015 Toni Weisskopf got more first-run votes for Best Editor Hugo than any prior winner, ever. Hell, she got more votes than many of the prior winners combined. And the Woke Children used 2,500 scab “votes” to trash Toni’s win — cough, not too different from how a hundred thousand Biden “votes” magically appeared overnight in key counties, back in November, cough — because they’ve always hated Baen as a business, and Toni by association, and also because the “wrong people” both nominated and voted for her. (see my essay, “The Mote in Gernsback’s Eye.”)

    In other words, they are the kids who never learned to share. Anyone who’s a parent knows that kid on the street, or in their neighborhood. That kid is an ill-raised kid with ill-tempered behavior, and is often prone to ill-mannered tantrums. Which have become more and more common at Worldcon at the same time Worldcon has contracted (like the core of a star after it’s gone nova.)

    Now? Worldcon is a shadow of its former self. And angry, pulsing core of Woke rage against . . . well, anyone who is not also Woke and filled with rage.

    Discon III in particular has been turbulent from the get-go, because the Woke Children are now so numerous in the ranks of WSFS — while all the actual adults either die, walk out, or are ejected — that it’s become a runaway effect. There is literally nobody to stop the nonsense. People who actually know how to do the work of running volunteer events are gone and not coming back. So who is running the show? Gadflies and Woke Kids. That’s how you get a physical venue imploding and taking all the deposits with it, while the Hugo volunteers walk out after being endlessly bashed for not coddling the Woke Kids enough, and then the Woke Kids seek flimsy excuses to eject still more adults, as was done to Toni Weisskopf.

    All of this is spelled out in Burge’s Law:

    1) Identify a respected institution.
    2) Kill it.
    3) Gut it.
    4) Wear its carcass as a skinsuit, while demanding respect.

    Only, I am not sure what respect is left for an event, and a body of people, who do not even respect themselves. Because there is no loyalty among Woke Folk. They are generally selfish, vain, competitive, neurotic attention whores, who each believe their Woke politics make them good people — while still being the same unpleasant individuals they’ve always been. They knife each other as readily as they knife the Other. In fact, now that Toni’s been bounced I am sure they will return to fucking people nominally on their side, as was done to the Discon III Hugo volunteers.

    And all of this is just so very, very sad.

    I was raised on a literary diet of stories of the Old Days of Worldcon. I am friends with people who remember those days, too. Because they were there. And to the last, they all lament what’s happened to WSFS and Worldcon in particular. Almost all of them have dropped out, or decamped to other events. They’ve gradually concluded that Worldcon cannot be saved. The contraction is beyond reversal.

    Well, I am sure Discon III — now almost certain to be virtual, because as mentioned earlier the physical venue imploded and took all the deposits with it — will be a rip-roaring Woke festival, filled with sound and fury, yet signifying nothing. Will they take the name “Hugo” off the award this year? It’s overdue. They already repealed the Campbell, after a winner used the opportunity to Woke-bash the man after whom the award was once named. Might as well finish the job. Call them what they are: the Wokies.

    Toni, meanwhile, still publishes a range of quality authors from across the political spectrum, and let’s not forget that certain Old Fans do honor her, as happened with National Fantasy Fan Federation, and the group of Old Fans calling themselves the Jovians. Those are the kind of people who remember the heart of Worldcon — from the Old Times — and who also keep the flame of SF/F alive in ecumenical ways. Versus the Woke Church which dominates Worldcon now.

    1. Hmmm…what we need is a Ninja to sneak in when none of the Social Justice Wankers are looking and swap out all the little plastic rockets with toilets to symbolize how they’ve flushed Worldcon and the Hugos down the shitter. 😀

      1. Given enough time, they’ll enter a purity death spiral ..

        … denouncing one another for increasingly petty violations of wokeness …

        .. in the meantime, they’re venomous, and wandering around, wearing the skin of a beloved institution.

        Watch your back, ignore what they say, and drive on.


        1. Happily, purity spirals don’t last forever. Eventually, either the worker bees get sick of the antics of the drones & wannabe queens, or enough worker bees get pushed out for things to stop working.

  47. Being just another no-name rando who happens to have been a consumer of science fiction since the 1960s, I don’t really count; but I’m looking through the comments here and putting all the authors I can find into my wish list so I can “fire as the guns bear” (i.e., as money for ebooks shows up). I’ll probably even look through used bookstores to find some paperbacks to fill up those increasingly popular “free library” boxes.

    Thank you all for making my life better with your shared dreams. May I be able to help others as you’ve helped me.

  48. I see it differently.

    Let me start with an anecdote. I was talking with a non-Progressive/Socialist who lived several years in DC. His observation was that about 5-10 of the folks were rich, elitist, woke, leftist, hypocrites. The others were younger, poorer, less wanna be elites, really leftist and super hypocrites — whose goal in life was to become part of the upper, elite, rich crust.

    Their whole goal in life was to out Progressive each other to get admitted to the Elysian Fields.

    So, we need to, I think look at reward structures. People do what they do in anticipation of reward. So the DC wannabes anticipate being rewarded for being more extreme than their competitors.

    In the realm of SF, the woke try to outwoke each other in anticipation of the diminishing rewards provided by the traditional publishers. I know of a solid author who has just been dropped by her publisher, in spite of respectable sales, and she is devastated — because she has been so woke. She paid her dues, but apparently didn’t get the memo that she is a white straight woman so she can never pay enough.

    Me? I only read a half dozen self-published authors. I no longer attend my local Con — I stopped when the next Con was proudly advertised as a woman only event — authors, panels, artists, GOH, Toastmaster. I do other things.

    1. Wokeness is a religion, but one where the main sacrament is finding someone more “problematic” than thou, and publicly canceling them.

    2. “I stopped when the next Con was proudly advertised as a woman only event — authors, panels, artists, GOH, Toastmaster. I do other things.”

      You do things other than women?

      (Sorry, couldn’t resist) And I need a bit of levity, because frankly, if I had a button that would condemn that utterly worthless piece of excrement Sanford to a painful, lingering death, I would mash it with glee.

    3. Make your own con. I was up to year 9 until the CCPox killed it. And I still got two mini virtual cons off the ground last year. Build up. Build over. Build around.

  49. Larry,

    I finally got a chance to write my piece on this piece of something…but for some reason the site won’t let me post the link here.

    Anyone want to check it over for me to make sure I didn’t miss anything? I threw in some great historical analogs that I pulled from memory and cross referenced. It is the top most article on my blog which is the Website listed.


    1. I read it earlier. It was a good piece.
      You can post links, they just get auto stuck in moderation until I clear them (its to block spammers)

  50. They’ve killed WorldCon, it’s just that it’s taking a while to die. The institution, such as it is, has been mortally wounded.

    Some of these miserable scags will try to find something else to ruin. The best solution is to ignore them completely and go on having fun.

    1. I suspect a lot of the long time supporters & attendees are doing it out of force of habit. And a lot more of them are going to just let their membership lapse and find other things to do.
      Kind of like a local tavern when the new owners try to go upscale. The old regulars that kept the place going get driven off, but they don’t get replaced by the new hipster clientele the owner was hoping to attract.

    2. “The best solution is to ignore them completely and go on having fun.”

      I no longer think that works. We are dealing with control freaks – they will never leave us alone. And if they can’t reach you, they will take down the things you love. Everything from the MCU to the NFL to Toni Weisskopf.

      “Their contortions, convulsions, and outbursts of gibberish at first baffled everyone, especially when other girls began to show similar symptoms. After Betty Parris and Abigail Williams, 12-year-old Ann Putnam, Jr. also began to show signs of strange behavior. Shortly after her illness, the Salem witch trials began, with the girls accusing neighbors of witchcraft”

  51. Let me get this straight: a white dude (Jason Sanford) got a female Jewish guest (Toni Weisskopf) disinvited from a convention . . . and the Woke crowd is cheering?

    Welcome to 2021.

        1. Consider just how many woke male feminist allies are creepy harassers, and there’s a lot of truth to that statement.

          1. Soooooo many.
            I think we’re up to 7 or 8 of the big Puppy Kickers from all those years ago who have since been outed as some form of creepy weirdo pervert.
            The more some dude screams about being a male feminist, the greater the odds he’s a rapist.

        2. And they really only like Jews whose Jewishness consists of the occasional ironic bite of matzoh, and/or who bleat endlessly about how evil Israel is, or who are room temperature.

          1. Their attitude about Catholics is similar–it’s fine and a little bit charming to identify as a ‘devout Catholic,’ so long as you don’t actually believe any of the stuff that conflicts with what the Right People think.

          2. You are so, so right.

            Some American Jews are finally beginning to open their eyes, but it’s a slow, slow process.

          3. You’re conflating being Jewish with having to automatically love Israel, the same thing that Jewish people who are deservedly critical of Israeli foreign policy (like Noam Chomsky, for example) get accused of. If Israel (and Israelis) get harped on, it’s up to them to change their foreign policies (much as how Americans like yourself need to do that-and a lot more else image wise-so that foreigners don’t think less of you or of the United States.)

          4. If your example is Noam Chomsky, the question had better be “Who Is The World’s Biggest Asshole?”

          5. Actually, what we saw during the last 4 years was a massive increase in anti-Semitic attacks in places like New York, and other bastions of “progressive tolerance”, of course they were targeting the Jews who actually believe in (and follow) their religion, who tend to skew conservative. The statistic of the increase in attacks was used to attempt to portray Trump as an antisemite, while ignoring the fact that the perpetrators were often liberal minorities, whose intersectional victim score was higher, and so the crimes didn’t count beyond trying to prove Orange man bad.

          6. I just…

            “You’re conflating being Jewish with having to automatically love Israel, the same thing that Jewish people who are deservedly critical of Israeli foreign policy (like Noam Chomsky, for example) get accused of.”

            Love of Israel is “automatic”. Criticism of Israel is “deserved.”

            “If Israel (and Israelis) get harped on, it’s up to them to change their foreign policies…”

            The abuse is their fault and they are responsible for it.

            “(much as how Americans like yourself need to do that-and a lot more else image wise-so that foreigners don’t think less of you or of the United States.)”

            Why the opinion of foreigners should mean jack-sh*t to anyone, I certainly don’t know. But I’ll note that this is more of the same blame game as with Israel, which can’t possible be admirable and can only be loved “automatically”.

            What a pathetic way to live.

  52. Spot on, Larry, and we’ll fucking delivered. This was such a cowardly, weak act. Everyone here in the military knows what accountability is. We know why ship captains get fired when the ship collides with someone while the captain is asleep. This situation is not the same goddamn thing. Toni did what she was supposed to do or at least what they expect of her. And it still wasn’t enough . These idiots are actually making the case that she herself is responsible for the moderation of every comment on the bar. And that is BS whether on a forum or on a ship.

    I’m just waiting for conventions to outlaw Barfly rooms. Just you wait that’s coming next.

  53. Epic rant Larry, and just what I need to channel my disgust for these people. I’ve never been to a con as I’m just a humble reader and fan of the MHI universe. But I understand honor, and truth, loyalty and graciousness, and those are vanishing qualities these days.

  54. Richard Fox, don’t besmirch the furries!

    John Smith, helping Toni is nice, but she probably needs less help that we think. Harming JS is better and needed.

    I’ve been to pre-Spokane WorldCons. Well, after DragonCon in 2019, I don’t feel the need to return to something withering on the vine.

  55. I would like to say Well Said” but that does not do justice to the absolute Beauty of that open letter.

    Mr. Correia ….Thank You.

  56. I’m not going to talk about how shitty the SFWA is. They’re not worth the breath it would take to do so.

    Instead, I’ll ask, how’s Toni holding up? What can we do to help her (other than letting people know just how horribly she’s being treated by these people)?

  57. When do dome influential people start some new conventions?

    I look at Andrew Torba and his current success with Gab, and that’s a full time job with a development team and server racks. Surely some of the more business minded members of the genre community can get together and create an apolitical (or even right of center themed) annual convention. Seems like there’s a market for it after everyone has been so turned off by the established cons.

    C’mon, if the Bronies could do it…

      1. Parler went back up on the 16th. Be interesting to see what the site is like now and how they handle ‘hate’ speech (not me, e.mail and posting on selected blogs is all the social media-ing I do).

    1. Why do you need influential people? Starting a convention requires nothing more than a desire to start a convention and some small skill at publicity.

      A convention is a mental construct. A bunch of people show up at a place, could be a hotel or a convention center or even somebody’s house, because they believe that, if they show up there, there will be a convention. And you know what? They’re right! However, some person has to be the first one to believe it and to hold on to that belief and try to spread that belief until it is shared.

      I’m a nobody, but I have run a couple of conventions. If anyone would like to talk about starting a new convention write to me cybersmythe at protonmail dot com and we can talk about it

  58. Worldcon is still around? Last time I looked, they’d already burnt down their cozy little village to spite Vox Day’s face, and were squatting in the smoking ruins arguing with each over about not using their preferred boutique pronouns.

    Fuck ’em and feed ’em fishheads. And God bless Toni Weisskopf.

  59. Can I bear your children! 🙂 That’s the best takedown I’ve ever read. Didn’t know the inner details of that complaint against Baen but knew it was pretty much a progressive hitjob by somebody who’s jealous of people with talent because they lack their own.

  60. I’ve not been on Baen’s Bar in probably 15 years. Always liked it, just don’t spend time that way. Our “intrepid reporter” explicitly pointed to several comments by newer, anonymous users. He has stirred up this pot to try to earn his shilling. Has it occurred to anyone else that Toni was named this year’s GoH before those posts/users appeared? Is it possible (or even plausible) that this whole thing is a way to monetize getting the SJW’s their way and kicking Toni out of Worldcon?

  61. I don’t like crowds and as far as I’m aware they don’t do cons in my area so no skin off my nose and all that BUT it seems to me this is merely a symptom of a larger problem – the Left not wanting to have to tolerate the presence of those they hate.

    So why not give them what they want? Abandon their institutions, their corporations, their products. Cease attending their events, cease buying their products, cease using their services or hiring their staff. When and where possible instead spend your money on conservative events, conservative products, conservative services and conservative staff. Buy Taiwanese or Japanese or Australian rather than liberal American. Better a possible friend end up with your money than a declared enemy. And if you can’t survive without that particular Netflix show or movie or book, then find a free copy online, or use your local public library. Where there’s a will there’s a way, and liberals will feel the pain when they can’t afford their morning lattes and pedicures.

    If the Left want a trade war then why not give it to them? Total boycott on everything.

    Hope this doesn’t sound sockpuppetish. : D

    1. Unfortunately they don’t understand boundaries. At all. What happens when you voluntarily remove yourself from Woke presence is they suddenly realize part of their unwilling audience has escaped… so they come looking to destroy any boltholes you have. It’s like fire ants. They just keep moving in unless actively fought.

    2. No reason to support people that hate you and want you dead.

      We have entertainment, hobbies and pastimes that don’t require fealty to the Corrupt Establishment.

    3. Have you ever been to Oz mate? We might vote for the “conservative party” more frequently than the commies but 90% of the country is populated by the exact type of people discussed in this article. The type who might disagree with the woke agenda but sit back and do nothing while their own friends and family are thrown under the bus. Bugger-all is made in Australia these days anyway besides farm produce and even that industry is nearly dead because of mismanaged water allocations (thanks to the conservative party no less)

  62. Spot bloody on, Larry. I have to agree with Bewildered. Total boycott on everything the wokies are running. I’ve given up on professional sports (except sportscar racing) and broadcast TV. I don’t read TOR books, or buy magazines that don’t feature firearms, so that’s a start. How else can we kick them in the hangers? What else can we do to hurt the Looney Left? I’m open to suggestions.

    1. Divest your consumer dollars the best you can.

      Look at what you do buy and see how woke some companies are… Gillette? They hate you. Disney? They hate you. Google? They hate you. Amazon? They hate you.

      Microsoft? Well don’t dig deeply into all the evil stuff their founder supports. On top of that he spends hundreds of millions of dollars on “grants” to press organizations.

  63. This is why I bitched about Baen shutting down The Bar to appease the mob. Apologizing is just blood in the water to the people that want you dead.

  64. “Morons on my side of the political would call her a sell-out, quisling, traitor, boot licker, so on and so forth, and they did.”

    Not being one of the aforementioned morons, can I at least point out that the morons were absolutely right about what would happen and why? Maybe they weren’t the morons after all.

  65. I have not enough thumbs to up for this post.

    Yep. Steph’s been simmering behind the scenes for a good while now, and she’s tired of it. If I were younger and in better health I’d do more, but I’m not and I’m not and there’s little to be done about that, but I can and am sharing this to MY groups, and anybody that gets their shorts bent outta shape about it is getting told where they can get off. A body does what s/he thinks is right, over and over, and tries to be friends, and gets stabbed in the back for it? Naw, man. Enough is enough.

  66. I’d have no expertise to contribute to this, but how long before Baen’s fans decide to build cons for Toni and each other? Ain’t like we can trust fen and SMoFs anymore, as the Sad Puppies proved.

    (Unfortunately, some Baen authors decided to side with puppy kickers. Not sure how that’d play out, for cons dedicated to being SJW-less.)

  67. I am sick of progressives, the woke, BLM, Antifa, use of selected made up words instead of English, extreme sensitivity to actual facts, and self appointed Susie Stasis’, who must inflict themselves on me/us, because they want to call me/us an entire group of names that we are alleged to be. You all know the usual names – I flat out don’t care what they think. Fortunately, if they go to my employer, my employer and associates *know* how I treat and work with colleagues, customers, vendors, and regular people. And even how I deal with those out of the norm. You know, like a decent human being would. Though it’s not going to matter, anyone who doesn’t preach the Word of the Woke Mob is going to be harassed, hounded, and possibly harmed by the Evil that is Woke.
    It’s been a rough day with surgery, so I am going to enjoy my gun magazines and law enforcement friendly shows.

    1. The progressives, the ‘woke’, BLM, Antifa (neither of which are totally organized organizations, but loose movements) are equally tired of neocons like you and are working to create a world where retrogressives like you will no longer exist, or at least will no longer be able to hurt people different then them physically or verbally. But I guess something is hard like that for privileged white neocons like you to take. What else is new?

      1. I really appreciate your comment. It’s refreshing and affirming to hear someone clearly state that they don’t want me to exist and will work to make sure it happens.

        It’s so tiring when people on the left try to pretend that they’re inclusive or tolerant or in any sense interested in individual expression or diversity.

      2. “a world where retrogressives like you will no longer exist, or at least will no longer be able to hurt people different then them physically or verbally.”

        so antifa flat out MURDERS a portland man in cold blood, shooting him twice in the chest (one bullet missed) and your response is to accuse the VICTIM of trying to hurt ANTIFA? You are batshit insane. antifa and blm are fascist movements intended to stir up hatred and bigotry and violence. they are doing a REALLY good job of that going by their body count which is up over 40 last I checked.

        you are just lying about people trying to hurt you so you can play the victim game. Every fascist and evil group in history has CLAIMED to be the victim. Nazi’s claimed jews were doing all sorts of nasty things to them which justified the concentration camps, every bit of it was a lie. Hamas makes up all sorts of lies NOW to justify the open declaration of intent by hammas to murder every last jew on the planet. You are no different. You lie so you can claim all the people you are attacking are somehow attacking you.

        All these people you CLAIM are hurting you are perfectly willing to LEAVE YOU ALONE. the problem is YOU arent willing to leave THEM alone.

        1. Indeed it’s kinda nice when the Woko Haram crowd finally admit the truth – kinda like the Nazis admitting they really only want to murder Jews.

          The fact is conservatives are tolerant – if anything too tolerant. The Left keep pushing their filth, anti-science drivel, and economically destructive policies, and the Right keep compromising. The problem is about the only thing remaining to compromise on is whether the Right is permitted to exist anymore. Some ‘Right’ politicians are quite willing to keep compromising, but the people are not.

          If domestic terrorism is acceptable – Antifa, the BLM, and everyone else Democrats are aiding and abetting, then the Left has no grounds to complain about peaceful rallies e.g. January 7th, or regular people choosing to defend themselves from terrorism when the Democrat authorities refuse to do their duty. Of course the Left never let truth or facts get in the way of their narrative so … 🙁

      3. The “movement” that happened on Jan 6th was a “loose movement” that also didn’t manage to kill anyone, unlike the “loose movements” of BLM and Antifa. The “loose movement” of Jan 6th didn’t do anywhere near the damage that the “loose movements” of BLM and Antifa in 2020 (really back to 2016). The “loose movement” on Jan 6th hasn’t received over 100 million in funding, nor do they have their own websites or enjoy support from politicians at the local level all the way up to the White House, unlike the “loose movements” of BLM and Antifa.

        Hell, the “loose movement” of BLM has one of the conspirators of the 1983 senate bombing working as a fundraiser for them. But hey – “loose movement”.

        But so I get this straight, because something is a “loose movement”, that excuses over 30 dead, billions in property damage, untold lives destroyed or ruined, and a massive spike in crime in all the cities the violence occurred. Do I have that right? I’m trying to keep score in your little game of Calvinball.

        Your posts definitely qualify as loose movements.

      4. You are a loose movement.

        Also, you really should at least go read the definitions of some of the political terms you’re tossing around, because you sound like a fucking dope.

  68. My introduction to science fiction came when I was caught sneaking into the high school library in 1949 (as a second grader!) to read “A Treasury of Science Fiction”, edited by Groff Conklin.

    For quite a few years now, my favorite publisher has been Baen. Looks like I need to start spending more money there…

  69. Does Baen sell hardback (or softback) books directly? I don’t do e.books, and I’m not keen on buying through bookstore sites and giving them data I’d rather them not have.

    If not I guess I’ll have to go to a bricks-n-mortar and pick something from Baen up.

    1. Don’t forget audio. I picked up two since this came out. Now I’ve got to read everything of Larry’s I haven’t already bought.

    2. No, distribution of physical books is through Simon & Schuster, that was the compromise Jim Baen offered S&S when they approached him to head up a new science fiction and fantasy imprint for them, he started his own with some financial backing and distributes through them (and amusingly enough, considering the role of Tor in general in all of this, Tom Doherty was one of his financial backers and is still a significant shareholder in the company).

      1. Thanks for the information and reply. I’ll figure out something (once a find a real live bookstore around here, COVID deep-sixed the ones I used to go to).

      1. I wanted to, but the hardcopy linked to various book sites, and I’d rather give them the money direct and not provide personal details. And I appreciate the plug for audiobooks, aivanther, but that’s another mode of ‘reading’ that doesn’t suit me well. Bricks-n-mortar it is.

  70. This is why I bitched about Baen shutting down The Bar to appease the mob. Apologizing is just blood in the water to the people that want you dead.

    1. “This is why I bitched about Baen shutting down The Bar to appease the mob”

      An invitation as Guest of Honor is not what was at risk. In fact, it can hardly be considered a loss, as it gained her the certainty that these people are false. What value is there in being honored by a den of spineless weasels?

      I’m all for fighting, but I’m not sure you understand what the SJWs are targeting, what is really at stake.

      Be a better tactician.

      1. Given my *very short* familiarity with this Joe ..

        .. I think he’s being the best tactician he can ..

        … I’m not sure he’s aiming at the same target, though.


        1. Adherence to Really Stupid Tactics is a very human thing to do. After all, “line up in masse and charge through that muddy, crater strewn field crossed by barbed wire into massed machine guns and ore-sighted artillery” was a respected tactic for a whole lot longer than one would think humanly possible.
          And those who like Really Stupid Tactics tend to be overly wedded to them, and can’t abide any suggestion that maybe they need to try something else.

          1. That’s a calumny against the WWI generals. Given the weapons available in 1915–16, and the existence of a continuous front that could not be outflanked at any point, they could either (a) make frontal assaults using massed infantry or (b) let the Germans keep northeastern France in perpetuity. The real trouble was that once begun, an attack could not be called off, because the first thing the artillery barrage did was to cut all the telephone wires, and field radios had not yet been developed. So if anything went wrong, a bloodbath was inevitable.

            (Sorry, a hobbyhorse of mine.)

          2. Yes and no. The was a pre-war belief, especially in the French armies, that enough elan and fighting spirit could overcome any opposition, as long as you were willing to take the casualties. When this sort of thing is institutionalized and part of one’s doctrine, it’s kind of a hard thing to shake, even when it’s obviously not working.
            Likewise, the English clung to the belief that if they could just force enough of a gap in the German lines, they could send the cavalry through and roll them up in their rear area.
            Even with technological shortcomings in communications (and communications is the key to tactics), there was enough institutional inertia to continue the same old thing, with hopes for different results.

          3. Yeah, but WWI was also when the Canadians invented blitzkrieg (which the Germans then copied in WWII, having suffered from it).

  71. Just a bit of advice for Baen:

    Harden yourselves. Move primary servers to a jurisdiction that does not kowtow to SJW sensibilities.

    Make Baen’s bar a pay service. Low priced with a free e-book is fine, but a pay service. Allows standing for tortuous interference lawsuits, and weeds out SJW snots.

    Avoid Parler’s mistakes.

    1. Larry posted numerous times in the other post that they were already working at revamping their web hosting to harden things. It’s just the stupid drive by hit piece came before they were ready.

  72. I am so disappointed in SF/F fandom, but, I’m sorry, also not surprised.

    Larry – I have a good friend who runs a hosting/web company who will gladly rehome you or anyone who wants to get onto a threat-free hosting service. Contact me if you’d like information.

  73. Not to reply with a cliche, but you are absolutely right. Like Worf would say “these people have no honor”.

    What a sad state of affairs this world has become.

    1. Honor!!?? The Left, along with maybe 99.98 % of Washington, DC are Honorless curs who have zero understanding that such a concept even exists.

      “Honor is better than bread.”

  74. Back in the 1990s I started going to local cons, met many new friends, had many magical evenings getting very drunk at room parties. In the early 2000s I did the same at several worldcons. Including some in other countries. Wonderful!

    Then I took a few years off from worldcon, due to small children and moving house, but returned to it a few years ago… And soon wondered: what the hell happened?? There are no big crowds at worldcon anymore. The attendees are greying rapidly. I’m one of the youngsters, being in my mid 40s. The few who are younger than myself seem like they came from a bizarre parallel timeline where Mao was an American. (Authors: feel free to use that. Turtledove already did the same for Stalin.) The most recent worldcon I went to, in KC MO, didn’t even have open room parties! Just sort of a weak imitation in the convention center’s main floor. The Hugos are a joke, handed out for crap where I’m actually happier if the description on the back cover makes no sense.

    The same things have been happening with the local cons. Folks are dying off or dropping out or at least going grey. The incoming generation is absolutely terrifying to anyone who has studied even a little bit of history. And most of the remaining old timers are welcoming the wannabe Cultural Revolutionaries with open arms! Heaven help you if you aren’t one of them.

    Example: At a local con a couple years ago, I saw someone in the con suite march right up to a self-described Libertarian (who had sponsored that hour’s munchies) and boldly proclaim: “being a libertarian means you want me to DIE!” It was all about socialized medicine apparently.

    The privately hosted room parties are in decline at local cons too. I won’t be surprised if COVID puts a stop to what’s left of the parties, assuming the cons ever go back to in-person before fading away completely.

    Sic transit gloria etc.

    1. > “being a libertarian means you want me to DIE!”

      “Yeah, probably. You seem like a jerk. Go bother someone else.”

      (Yeah, ok, so I don’t have many friends… 😉 )

      1. The man from the peanut gallery had some kind of very expensive uninsurable chronic preexisting condition. His thought process went something like: “My life depends on state-provided medical care. These people want to abolish government. Therefore, they want me to die.” Really, that’s it in a nutshell. Didn’t give the libertarians much of a chance to discuss other ways that his medical care could be provided for in a free society. Nor did it occur to him that many people who aren’t actually an-caps still support the libertarian cause, because it’s the closest thing in their area to constitutionalist or even just “hey we shouldn’t lock people in cages for smoking the wrong kind of cigarette”. Nope. For him it was evil anarchists vs his access to medical care.

    2. “At a local con a couple years ago, I saw someone in the con suite march right up to a self-described Libertarian (who had sponsored that hour’s munchies) and boldly proclaim: “being a libertarian means you want me to DIE!” ”

      Did you start singing the Remy song back to them?

  75. “… all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them…”

    I hate playing defensively. Where is the petition to abolish WorldCon? Why would honest people continue to put up with this kind of crap? Why wouldn’t we de-platform them or better still set up a counter-convention instead of just waiting for the axe?

  76. I’ve taken to buying my books on Baen when I can. (Rather live in a world with more than one bookstore.) Sad to hear the proprietor is being harassed by these pissy cliquish losers.

    Are there any informal social groups that don’t eventually get taken over by cluster-B drama queens? How was sci-fi back in the days of Heinlein and Asimov? Some of the things I read suggest that there were toxic “social organizers” back then too, but the professionals mostly ignored them.

    A group of friends engaging in creative fun sounds wonderful. Seems like it’s a lure though. A group of mean-girl-style backstabby schemers sounds like elementary school.

  77. Toni and the Baen crowd should have left world con after the asshole awards. They showed what they thought of her and all the sad puppies then.

  78. Not surprising they cancelled Toni.

    If you want to help Toni, just buy directly from Baen. I’ve been doing that for years. Money is one of the most sincere expressions of appreciation.

    After the Sads debacle – I stopped buying SF books from people who dislike me and mine. Plenty of books to read. No need to give a hater my money.

    Larry, enjoyed your rant. But the best revenge is not to give them money or attention while enjoying your life.

  79. And let us not ever forget, for even a moment, that WorldCon was a hotbed and safe haven for pedophilia (I’m looking at you, Walter Breen).

    These people are absolute and utter hypocrites; sheltering, promoting, and I would add abetting child predators behind their precious, gilded doors.

  80. I’m sure the strategy of feeding everyone around you to the alligator so it eats you last will work out just fine. The Work-mobs are known for being satiated after a certain number of scalps, and will definitely stop.

  81. I’ll be honest, I didn’t even know Ms. Weisskoph had been scheduled to be a GOH at wirlcon untill this broke, and my first thought was to ask “Why is she even bothering to attend at all?”. Not because I think she is “letting down the side”, or a quisling, or anything like that, but because, quite frankly, I couldn’t figure out whats in it for her, or for Baen. Maybe I’m not representative of fans in general, but to me at least, Baen is bigger, more important, and more respected than they are. I mean am I nuts, or is Baen being involved in worldcon like the rolling stones entering in an asshole arkansas battle of the bands sponsored by the local radio station?

    1. What’s Toni’s goal? More readers, and more sales.

      There’s bound to be some people at WC who haven’t tried a Baen’d book .. who haven’t read Bujold or Flint .. who don’t know our host the ILoH except by fabulist reputation.

      Toni, far as I can tell, would like them to have better books, ones that aren’t just the current iteration of Woko SJWism .. because then she gets more sales, and Baen thrives.

      I’m not Toni, nor am I telepathic .. but Occam says it’s really that simple


      1. Most of the people who still go to Worldcon are either working in the field, or poseurs who want to suck up to get a reputation as SMOFs. Everybody there can be assumed to know what Baen is, and who Bujold and Flint are, and so forth, and to have already made up their minds on the subject.

        Cons have always been a rotten way to publicize authors. Worldcon doubly so. For the ‘woke’ corpse of Worldcon, that goes about fifty times.

        1. Itty bitty quibble …

          Conventions are a rotten way to publicize authors .. but they were, prior to Ye Olde Internet, one of several rotten options available.


          1. It was supposedly one of the very few places for authors to meet editors and hopefully garner a request to submit. Used to be quite a bit of advice on how to handle that, how to write the letter when you sent your submission, carefully reminding the editor that they did actually request you send it.

            I’ll agree that it was undoubtedly a crap solution and also that it was one of the few solutions, all crap, that were available at the time.

            I’m not sure what it is, now, other than exactly the same as any small regional convention. You won’t make professional contacts, you won’t sell any books or manage promotion, but you get to hang with your friends.

    2. Toni is more forgiving than a lot of us, and the people that approached her were apparently sincere about their feeling bad about the treatment she got in 2015, offering the Editor GoH spot as an apology.

      As I understand it from elsewhere, the people who invited her quit between then and now, more or less driven out by Woketards and their behavior. Per standard SocJus tactics, their Fellow Travelers stepped into the open positions, and did what happened here.

  82. You know how we all keep joking, “Don’t hold back, Larry, tell us how you really feel”? I think we just saw what happens when Larry doesn’t hold back.

    Now if you’ll excuse me, I need to clean up the debris in my office due to the massive explosion that just came out of my computer screen.

  83. Larry – if they’re spamming your ISP to try to get you and Baen de-platformed, I know a free-speech loving ISP owner who will host you guys. Email me if you want that information.

  84. Ahh, must’ve nuked the troll “Sean”. Too bad, but I totally get why.

    The drunk guy acting like an idiot at the party is fun to laugh at sometimes, but most of the time you’re better off tossing him out in the street and locking the door.

  85. As a conservative author, I would love to help spearhead a collaboration between Baen Books and the Daily Wire, especially since the Daily Wire is already branching out into the movie industry. I grew up going to cons like LTUE and WorldCon, and always looked forward to speaking to Larry and listening to his panels. Now, like many other conservative authors who are trying to succeed, we feel ostracized and set up for failure everywhere we turn. It’s time to push a stronger counter movement in publication.

  86. Thanks, Larry.

    Honestly, it was hard for me to get too amped up about the decision itself, because there was zero chance it wouldn’t happen given the current climate at Worldcon.

    What I think is perhaps more significant: the usual crowd is angry that it took them *too long* to deplatform Weisskopf, and the statement felt the need to pre-emptively apologize for even deliberating over the decision, despite the fact that the outcome was never in doubt. That seems like a conceptual escalation, even if it’s a bit of an abstract distinction.

    1. You know, don’t you, that none of that matters? The woke folk have no standards. Their standards change with the wind, and they think that’s good — good postmodernists are about the strength of your emotion, which is the reflection of your “authentic self” and answers to no one — not about rules or standards. But they are all about holding YOU to your rules and standards. They don’t care if their own are pedophiles, racists, or anything else. They can say, think, and do anything because their INTENTIONS are pure. It’s nice to point this out to people who haven’t caught on yet, but none of them will care how much of it you expose. To them, their begin able to do and say anything they want without the repercussions they demand of others is a feature, not a bug.

  87. I was an old time Worldcon member. I was even an apprentice SMOF

    By the time Sad Puppies 1 rolled around, I was mostly gone from that scene. I missed it and SP2. But SP3’s nomination victories got me to join Sasquan.

    After they NoAwarded Toni, I realized that blowing them off was indeed the correct choice

    Looking at DisCon’s page, I’m glad they canceled Toni. Seriously, Chicago?

    I don’t want Toni shot, so I’m glad she’s not going

    And I’m glad I’m not going, either

  88. Huge Correia fan, but the only reason I found his books was via Baen. Just facts. Thus, this all makes me sad/angry/confused (must be a good German word for that). Anyone who is remotely paying attention knows that Toni Weisskopf is a great editor and champion of science fiction / fantasy.

    Well, the best thing is to vote on who is a great editor with my dollars. I used to buy direct from Baen. Not sure why I stopped. Man the Monthly Bundles continue to be a sweet deal! [seriously, as a Correia fan, check out the 18 dollar August Bundle].

    Preaching to the choir a bit, but:
    1. Go there now;
    2. Open an account (or resurrect an old one); and
    3. Buy something.

  89. Ok,

    1: It’s in DC, not Chicago.

    Which means I’m really glad Toni isn’t getting stained there.

    2: Karma:
    Many of you know we have contracts with two hotels, the Marriott Wardman Park and the Omni Shoreham Hotel. We’ve spent the past month in constant negotiations with both and are continuing to negotiate. We can say the Omni Shoreham has been very flexible with us in our ongoing talks, and we want to thank them for that.

    The Wardman Park’s owner has filed for bankruptcy, announced the hotel’s permanent closing, and their intent to sell the property ( We are currently retaining legal counsel regarding this issue.

    For legal reasons, this means we cannot give any updates regarding the dates of DisCon III.

    We share your frustration with the situation. Many of us on staff have been unable to plan our Worldcon properly, given the ongoing ambiguity levels.

    We are also sorry that, as of now, we cannot release the survey results. Our concern stems from our belief that releasing the survey now, while still in talks with both the Wardman Park and the Omni Shoreham, potentially could make it more challenging to reach an equitable conclusion for all parties involved.


  90. It’s interesting looking at the past and future Worldcons.
    It used to be that a non-North American (US or Canada) Worldcon was a rare thing. And when there was a serious non-NA bid, everyone cleared the way for it.

    1992-98: North America
    1999: Melbourne
    2000 – 2004: North America
    2005: Glasgow
    2006: North America
    2007: Yokohama, Japan
    2008 – 2009: North America
    2010: Melbourne
    2011 – 2013: North America
    2014: London
    2015 – 2016: North America
    2017: Helsinki
    2018: North America
    2019: Dublin
    2020: Wellington
    2021-22: North America

    Looking forward:
    Chengdu, China in 2023
    Memphis, TN, USA in 2023

    Glasgow, Scotland in 2024

    Brisbane, Australia in 2025
    Seattle, WA, USA in 2025

    Jeddah, Saudi Arabia in 2026
    Los Angeles in 2026
    Nice, France in 2026
    Orlando in 2026

    What it looks like to me is that Worldcon is dying. They’re narrowing down to a group of people who “go to Worldcon” while traveling.

    Hope they have fun with that

    1. Nice, France backed out. They don’t see any way they can run Worldcon after all the COVID (and after all the Muslim terrorism and Christian martyrdom in Nice, but they’re not going to mention that).

      Chengdu and Jeddah are both cities of oppression (sorry, nice folks who happen to live and be oppressed there).

  91. ffs, just avoid freakin’ conventions in toto … i used to enjoy ’em back in the day (met a longtime gf at a TusCon in the ’90s) but they’ve gotten woke to the point of in(s)anity

    they used to be fun to just party at or mack on attractive denizens (in that Kirk-like old school manner not the creepy Harry Knowles-gamma way) but now even that’s verboten … cons putting out 6′ tall standup signs around event entrances warning against any kind of very broadly-defined harassment … big letters COSPLAY IS NOT CONSENT and a wall of fine print under it like a legal disclaimer regarding all the stuff you’re not supposed to do (takin’ pics/vids of people even in public w/o consent can now get you expelled w/o refund) …

    solutions … alternative cons maybe? find out where the enemy’s con is being held, rent out some space nearby for the same time frame, pass out tons o’ fliers for your event right outside the woke-o-con’s doors

    (even if it’s just, say, a big hotel room party … fck, half the time all people want is an excuse to party flirt w/fellow freaks while discussin’ their favorite geeky trivia that no one else understands … don’t complexify it

    1. Looked at his tweet. Can’t reply as I refuse to have an account, but I am sorely tempted to slap that clown down for his cowardly remarks.

      Sanford can post lies, and not be challenged for those lies… What a douche.

      1. The Radical Left look to be circling the wagons around Sanford, and seeking to attack any ‘dangerous reactionary’ who challenges him. Any questioning of his claims or contacting his employer about their stance on retaining an employee who writes fiction favouring child abuse, grooming, incest, or any of the other things Smith\Hopkins mentions, is deemed harassment\abuse\violence\whatever.

        Sanford’s allegedly independent investigation (aka suspiciously coordinated hitpiece filled with errors, misquotes, and other crimes against journalism) is being treated as gospel – oh sorry I should use a Christophobically acceptable term, Gospel of Marx? Given File770 & Co. appear to have a hate for Baen, or indeed any non-Left author, I’m not sure facts are really relevant. Again it is highly suspicious but not definitive proof of coordinated action to deprive others of their lawful right to peacefully assemble and freely exchange lawful ideas and thoughts.

        File770 appears to be heavily reporting on the Sanford situation with articles documenting his alleged victimisation – anyone shining a light where it’s not wanted, or asking questions that are unwelcome. Given Sanford’s employer is a media association that likely means they’ll lean Far Left (though it’d be nice to be wrong) and their customer base is likely equally skewed so conservative displeasure will have no more effect than folk in Israel complaining about folk in Gaza launching rockets at them. Naturally the Gazans don’t see a problem with terrorism, and neither does the Left – it’s just a fiery but peaceful protest\investigative report\deplatforming.

        It’s possible letters\emails\phone calls to ONMA asking about their stance on the things Sanford’s written about will have an effect, but it’s about as likely to be successful as complaining to Twitter and other social media services or platforms that Sanford’s using to promote child torture etc. Sadly the Left have such control that challenging Leftist orthodoxy is a Herculean effort. Then again David was never supposed to beat Goliath so anything is possible.

        1. Going after Sanford feels cringy to me but then I think, dude, people in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones, no matter how popular you hope it makes you.

          Writing gross, disturbing, things seems to be a hallmark of “literature” so I’m not inclined to put a huge amount of weight on fiction that is gross and disturbing. But it does remind me of one of the other “non-traditional” students (read “old”) when I was in college, had me read his creative writing assignment and it was overt sexual grooming and gross and I don’t recall what non-committal thing I said for feed-back because it did seem to have that “I read this now I want to slit my wrists” element that “literature” seems to promote.

          He also talked about trying to take some legal-ish action against the school because he was being denied full access because his prof allowed his 18 year old female classmates to refuse to partner or do group projects with him.

          And I’m sort of like, you’re a pervert. Do you think they can’t tell?

          1. Being a somewhat recent “non-traditional” student in a creative fiction class, I used to joke with the professor that the class could be better described as “How to Write Psychos”. We read – and most other students wrote – generally depressive stuff. Thankfully we weren’t really exposed to any real degeneracy and perversion, but I got the feeling that sort of submission wouldn’t have elicited much recoil.

            It reminds me of watching an author panel where some fairly well-known mil SciFi guy said about Tolkien that today’s writing was reflective of a grittier time. I was like, as opposed to Tolkien’s time and experience?? And this guy, I think, was a vet. Guy wasn’t even old enough to have been a vet in a prolonged or “gritty” conflict, and he should have known better. Sort of like today’s political agitators and activists truly think they’re fighting real oppression.

            I can’t remember, and can’t find it, but it reminds me of some “law” that someone came up with about people needing to invent new conflict to retain that sense of struggle since the convenience and protection of modern society brings more comfort and safety. Older literature from far more difficult times is nowhere near as chaotic, depressive, and frankly psychotic as much of today’s dreck that passes for “literature”.

  92. Hmmmm…..,a entertaining and informative rant!

    I as a avid reader for decades heard a little about all this sjw nonsense in the sci-fi/fantasy vein but had no idea how far it actually went.

    I will look into Baen books,never heard of em but am sure must have read a few.

    This rant was picked up bu The Intrepid Reporter,how I found out about it so the word is spreading!

    1. If Big Country sent you, you’re in the right place.

      Do read some of Larry’s books, if you haven’t already. I’d recommend reading the Dead Six trilogy, since you’re from that side of the web already.

  93. Bravo.
    What’s going on everywhere is ridiculous, and it’s time for the spineless to grow a spine and stand up, or slink away.

  94. Some further thought:

    There’s no way that they didn’t know about Baen’s Bar when they invited Toni. For them to be doing this now means one of two things:

    1: They had a “coup”, and the people who lost the fight about Toni the 1st time around managed to toss out enough other people to get the decision reversed

    2: The invitation was given in bad faith, with the intention to dump her whenever they thought they’d get the most political bang for doing so.

    Given that they’re currently dealing with the loss of one of their two hotels, now seems like a time when they need a squirrel.

    In any event, IMO Toni’s far better off not being part of the Con.

    And this gives all other Worldcons (Chicago, which is next year, as well as the existing bids) a chance to speak up for decency, or for censorship.

    I don’t expect any of them to do the right thing here. But I was amused that the statement about the whole thing was very pointed in saying “we don’t have anything to do with that decision”. Which they don’t. ConComs run the Con.

    Now, if Ben Yallow had any balls, he’d be dumping his GoH position. And anyone who continues to participate in DisCon is showing their true colors. So I will be checking their membership and staff postings, to see who failed their test

    1. I’m going with Option #2 myself. They need 2 Minute Hate fodder, and Toni’s got enough coincidental connection to Sad Puppies to merit public pillorying and a show trial- at least in the minds of the sick batch of wannabe mean girls who run the thing.
      And as you mentioned, it’s a nice distraction from the incompetence of the current, sub-Frye Fest level organizers.

      1. The main failure with Frye Fest was in ‘rescuing’ the attendees before they got the full “Lord of the Flies” LARP going …

        .. but that’s just one cat’s opinion.


  95. So far, I’ve picked up a collection including a couple Coreias I hadn’t read, a Bujold I’d been meaning to get to, and of course ‘Gun Runners’.

    So far, I haven’t been disappointed.

    This is not my surprised face.


  96. I let a local(Central FL)Talk Radio program know about the Forum being closed. I’ll let them know that the left also screwed Toni(who is also a mother to a special needs child) out of being guest of honor because of that liar, Jason Sanford.

    Working to have a Not My Presidents day April 29th. If I had the skills, I’d make it a freaking event! Hope everyone does the same, because Biden-Harris and the DNC/PLD are the reason bugs like Sanford are crawling out from under their dung piles…
    Also gonna keep trying for a ‘Con to replace these Pussy-Cons. Maybe call it… BAEN-Con…

    1. The Left claims silence is violence, and yet Woko Haram is committed to silencing the non-Right. Clearly the Left are in love with violence.

    1. To prevent spam, we have to approve first time posters. (Although sometimes the system thinks it’s a first time post, even if you’ve posted before.)

    1. I don’t think we’ll be informed about that anytime soon. Baen’s legal advisors will have to be consulted, the corporate risk will need to be assessed, etc.. The first duty of corporate management is to ensure that the company survives, if that includes the Bar, great. If not, so be it. I for one don’t want to see Baen the publisher driven out of business by wannabe writers out of spite. I do want to continue to buy books published by Baen.

  97. Great way to claim violence. Tell you to shut up because you’re not parroting the Woke line and then claim that your silence is harmful.

    They don’t want you to be silent. They want you to say ‘Four legs good, two legs better, Woke leg best!’

  98. Hi there, I have been following this story and I have written a followup piece about Jason Sanford.

    “We Need to Talk About Jason: Jason Sanford’s Writing, Underage Girls, Torturing Children and Child Abuse”

    Jason Sanford has published particularly vile material involving the torture of children, that may gratify paedophile sadists. I personally feel this material is not something that should be used to make a profit and would be concerned if he was allowed to attend WorldCon 2021. Please consider signal boosting / doing your own followup.

    The allegations were put to Sanford, and his employers, and were not denied. Nor was an extension of time requested.

  99. James, if your comment has links it often goes into moderation- helps cut down on spam. If it doesn’t work the first 3-4 times you try to reply, chances are the next 3-4 times aren’t going to suddenly fix that ;D

    1. Thanks, I did not know that. Explains why I thought it wasn’t working right.

      Universal pulled the six Dr. Seuss books to make the publishers happy, and is looking to refurbish their Dr. Seuss attraction as well…

      I can’t imagine what happens when the aliens land and start being ‘Mean Aliens’ to everyone, because they can… HEY LARRY!!! Got a story idea for ya…

    1. The author of that blog post is reaching a bit–if we’re going to go by “if torture is a theme in your work then you’re a sadist” no one should ever be anywhere alone with Tom Kratman–but it does seem like Sanford goes in for the “shock value” school of writing.

  100. You said: ‘just kept giving the award to the same assholes from the same publishing house, over and over and over, as you ignored Toni because she was at that publishing house. The uncouth one. You talk a big game about “honoring strong women” as you took turns rotating through the same cadre of old white dudes for best editor.’

    The last male ‘Long Form, Best Professional Editor’ worldcon winner was in 2013. There have only been two in the 10’s. One won twice. Toni was nominated no less than 4 times in the 2010s, most recently losing to Sheila Gilbert, who holds a similar position to her at DAW books (and has done so for significantly longer), and had also never received recognition from the Hugos before then, besides a few nominations. There were also 5 different publishing houses represented (most of the major major players have a win EXCEPT Baen).

    I don’t think your argument here holds any water, and, in fact, I think you are kinda spouting bullshit here.

    1. You fucking idiot.
      I’m the one who got Toni those noms. I started Sad Puppies in 2013.
      Hayden (Tor) is the reason they split long form off of short form so that he could win.
      Jim Baen had to die to get nominated.

      Here’s what I wrote on this blog about it in 2015
      “Yet before Sad Puppies came along, Toni had never received a Hugo nomination. Zero. The above mentioned Patrick Nielsen Hayden has 8. Toni’s problem was that she just didn’t care and she didn’t play the WorldCon politics. Her only concern was making the fans happy. She publishes any author who can do that, regardless of their politics. She’s always felt that the real awards were in the royalty checks. Watching her get ignored was one of the things that spurred me into starting Sad Puppies. If anybody deserved the Hugo, it was her. This year Toni got a whopping 1,216 first place votes for Best Editor. That isn’t just a record. That is FOUR TIMES higher than the previous record. Shelia Gilbert came in next with an amazing 754. I believe that Toni is such a class act that beforehand she even said she thought Shelia Gilbert deserved to win. Fans love Toni.”

      From 2007 (when long form split off to salve Nielsen-Hayden’s ego) to 2020, Tor editors got nominated 24 times. And the only years they didn’t own the noms were those years in the middle where my people got involved.
      So take your revisionist history bullshit and stuff it.

  101. You’re cherry picking *hard*. Guess what, in an industry that has fewer than 10 major players, there are going to be winning streaks. That’s the nature of awards shows. And Tor in the 00s was a fucking juggernaut (I mean, they still are, but even more so then.)

    You’re absolutely right, awards shows are almost as much about politics as they are achievement. Guess why Toni didn’t have any wins? *She didn’t play the politics game.* Which is FINE. It’s not misogynist. or racist or w/e you want to call it if she doesn’t want to participate. If you want awards, you gotta schmooze. I’m not saying it’s a good thing, but it’s how it works. Other women had no issues acquiring noms and wins for themselves. (close to a dozen in the 90s and 00s. I’m not inclined to do a statistical analysis, but I suspect if you did, you would find the number of female noms and wins is roughly equivalent to their representation in the industry, averaged over a period of 30 years or so. As female representation increased, they got more wins, who knew?)

    1. Oh fuck off, Johnny Come Lately. You don’t think people already broke that all down six years ago when it was the current topic?
      But always there’s some fuck wit who blunders in years after everybody else has moved on with life to ask those hard hitting gotchas that we already talked about ad nauseum previously.
      So yay.
      Your whole 2nd paragraph is a vapid hot take restating the obvious, and missing the fucking point, because at the time the Hugos allegedly weren’t about politics or schmoozing, they claimed to be about being the best and most popular works. I was the barbaric outsider that said nope, they’re about cliques and politics, and it took three years before they finally admitted I was right and that it wasn’t for All Of Fandom (as claimed) but rather for just their special little group (thanks GRRM!). So now many years later I’ve got to listen to some bumblefuck stroll in, whine about my one sentence description of a complicated topic I’ve written a book worth of others posts about wasn’t complete enough to satisfy him and didn’t have an annotated bibliography attached.
      So fuck off. Holy shit. Get a hobby.

      1. Also, you fucking idiot, I, and many others, were inclined to do a statistical analysis.
        The problem wasn’t the misogyny, because they love giving awards to women, but they all had to be liberal women. They loved to brag about “diversity” but the year before I showed up that meant the winners were 16 white liberals and 1 Asian liberal. As far as the actual analysis put together (ironically, by a liberal who didn’t like me and originally thought my allegations were bunk) of the prior 260 something nominees only like a dozen could be identified as openly Other Than Left. And remember, this was back when everyone important was still claiming that politics played no part in their sainted award for the Best.
        The one gnat you are straining at while simultaneously swallowing a camel, was in that one category Toni kept getting snubbed in, the champions of diversity kept cycling through the same cadre of old white dudes. Which is exactly what I fucking said in this recent post you are whining about.

        But the rest of us who actually participated and paid attention during all this already know all this shit, so seriously, quit wasting my fucking time, you useless fucking dope.

        EDIT: I had to change Other Than Liberal to Other Than Left, because I forgot the fucking communists!

        1. Why are you so fucking angry?

          Dude, I’m a *fan*. We’ve met. I helped plan panels you were on. I’ve spent a bunch of money on your books. I’ve been *ON* convention panels with other Baen writers (though not you I don’t think).

          I don’t agree with you (though I’m going to stop there, because it doesn’t seem like any agreement is going to be reached) RE: the Hugos, but have you considered being less of a fucking asshole about it? You might have more luck persuading people if you did.

          1. Lol.

            1. Why am I angry? Well, gee whiz, Fake Name Internet Rando #28790, I can’t possibly imagine why my thin veneer of civility has been worn away by an endless parade of fucking morons who weren’t there “calling me out” about shit they clearly know nothing about, as they nitpick and whine and get all their facts wrong, for years.

            2. You are a fan and have this great resume of being such a super nice guy in person? Oh yeah. That should have been obvious to me Fake Name Internet Rando #28790 by your abbreviated name and fake email. Sadly, my mind reading powers were remiss, and I forgot all our good times at (INSERT EVENT X HERE). But it should have been obvious to me what a great guy you were, as you fucked up all your history, got everything incorrect, and grew increasingly offended and butt hurt how the guy who was actually there had no patience for your bullshit.

            3. Oh yeah. I’m sure that if I was nicer and infinitely patient with the revisionist history barfed up by random morons, I’d be far more persuasive among the gas lighting internet rando community. Drat. My bad. Sadly I never argue to sway the willfully ignorant. I argue for the audience. And since you are so damned slow and this post is old the audience is all gone.

            Now get a clue and fuck off, you tiresome git.

  102. Speaking of the same people year after year. I’m not making this up, okay. Not a bit.

    I was looking at the group pictures of the Hugo award winners. I saw one picture. I scrolled to the next picture. I thought – “WHY DID THEY GO CHANGE THEIR CLOTHES AND TAKE A SECOND PICTURE?”

    Then I noticed that the carpet was different and the two pictures were in a different room/hotel and must have been taken different years.

    Not only were the same people in each picture, but they were standing in the same spots. (Which makes sense with human nature and all, we tend to sit in the same spot at different tables, too, but it contributed to my initial reaction.)

    1. Heh.

      When regular meetings happen in the same conference room, I deliberately vary where I sit.

      Freaks people out.

      People a little freaked out do a better job of listening.


      1. I’ve known people so set in their ways that they have three to five whole identical outfits for working days, a couple of casual weekend outfits and a “Sunday best”, And I’m not talking about people in uniformed services.



        1. Yes, that’s a recognized lifestyle choice- they spend less time considering what they will wear and move on to whatever else they want to spend time on.


          1. Perhaps, but I wouldn’t be inclined to assign a developer who wears a blue denim shirt and khaki chinos to work every day to anything that requires the ability to think outside the box.



  103. I have done a new and shocking followup piece on the head official who deals with “Code of Conduct” breach allegations for WorldCon. Heather Urbanski is also a teacher. She is an Associate Professor of English at Fitchburg State University.

    She has been the subject of numerous student complaints of improper conduct over a course of 8 years. That is just students – no connection to her failing to deal with Jason Sanford’s child torture filth and ban him from WorldCon! :O

    Article here –

  104. Someone in all these posts, not me, proposed refering to the cancellation folks as the woko-haram. I have now seen Erik Erikson use the term. Good work, whoever it was!

    The variant Woke-O Haram is also out there and a bit clearer.

  105. So I see that the patrons of this site (as well as its webmaster) still are in denial of reality, and think that George Floyd deserved what happened to him, and that free speech means that you can say anything you want to say anywhere at any time.

    Seems that nobody leaned anything this year other than having hurt ‘feewings’ about the sci-fi bookstore burning down; a misplaced sense of priorities for a place that should never have been in an area like that one in the first place (there also should be concern about rents being too high, so high that a bookstore like this couldn’t have been in a shopping mall in a white area, or in one of the downtown districts; also, there should be concern about how chain stores can hog all of the retail space in the downtown [or near-downtown] areas of a city while leaving independent businesses to be pushed out to the margins [discussed in great detail here:

    Yeah, nobody here (including the webmaster of this site) commenting bothered to get out of their (neocon) comfort zones and get a different perspective on what happened (or to figure out that it most likely wasn’t blacks that did this, but was white male malcontents out to stir up shit and make the black people look bad), other than feeling hurt that a bookstore was burned down. This is why said webmaster and his friends in the sci-fi lit world got the plastering they did from the wider mainstream media as uncaring neocon ideologues out to wreck literary sci-fi, and with bans from conventions as a result, and why, unless they change, more of the same will happen in the near future.

      1. Not to mention that it was a year-old blog post that wasn’t actually about Uncle Hugo’s. You would think that if Lefty’s goal was to resurrect an ancient thread in order to repost an old argument, he would at least choose a blog post on the topic of his rant.

    1. You know what? This comment has earned Lefty/Mark/Solex a ban. I’m done with his tiresome idiotic bullshit.
      He usually just screams about whatever the leftist orthodoxy of the day is and then makes stupid threats about how I’m going to get banned from more events.
      But the bit about Uncle Hugos is too fucking stupid to let him live. That book store had been in that same neighborhood since the 1970s.

      1. I agree Larry, at first I thought his post MUST be a joke to try and get a rise out of people. I’m all for allowing people to express their opinions, but what he posted was NOT an opinion but a mean spirited delusion. No justifiable reason to give it a platform or expose others to that kind of BS

  106. “… a place that should never have been in an area like that…”

    Why not a book store? What, Lefty, you don’t think people of color know how to read?

    As an author, I am delighted that purchasers of any color buy my books.

    1. After all, Woke is a more socially acceptable way to be openly racist. Just hide the white supremacy under a veneer of Caring and Concern, and they can discriminate and segregate all they want.

    2. Even though he would never answer, I’d like to see him post a list of the types of stores he thought should be in that area. The racism would be off the charts.

      I suppose he thinks women who wear short skirts are just asking for it too.

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