Monster Hunter Nation

Michael Z. Williamson sums up rape education and response

An excellent, detailed, comprehensive, well documented post by Mike:

http://www.michaelzwilliamson.com/blog/item/rape

So as the other side is putting words in my mouth, or saying that people like me and Mike don’t believe in education or all that nonsense, nope. Mike’s response is fairly representative of how most people on my side of this debate feel about the issue.

Peter Grant on educating rapists
Correia uses a bad word, and it is the Worst Thing Ever: SJW Outrage of the Week

Leave a Reply

40 Comments on "Michael Z. Williamson sums up rape education and response"

Notify of
avatar

Larry Mitchell
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

exactly, I really hate it when incompetents (Scalzi and Hines) in this area are espousing opinions that will get people killed

Guest
2 years 3 months ago

+1 to that

Quirel
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

Wow. I was expecting weapons-grade snark in such epic concentrations that the EPA would put his IP address on the Superfund list.

But that was cogent, well written, and calm. I’m impressed. Kind of sad that we didn’t get anything as snarky as his “Let’s treat cars like guns!” post, but this will be much more useful in internet debates.

dyingearth
Guest
dyingearth
2 years 3 months ago

Mad Mike can be extremely rude and obnoxious with right occasion. This isn’t one of those. He’s being serious.

The Phantom
Guest
2 years 3 months ago
Wait, this is a “debate”? With logic and stuff? I have to say it ain’t. This is Miss Utah saying something entirely unremarkable, and you saying the same thing to back her up, and now MZW saying the same thing to back you both up, while a bunch of mentally ill people call y’all names and pretty much have a public freak-out. Oh, plus the likes of Mr. Scalzi and Mr. Hines snipe from the sidelines for political gain. Which I find putrid. Saying “women should protect themselves from rapists” is factual on the same level as “water is wet”… Read more »
Wes S.
Guest
Wes S.
2 years 3 months ago
Well, isn’t this how “debates” with liberals typically go? We try to use reason and logic and they throw tantrums. Then when we call them on their BS, they go all pearl-clutchy and have a fit of the vapors. The “problems” here are that the rad-fems and their pussified male allies like Scalzi are starting from the premise that all men are rapists, and that their definition of “rape” is so malleable that it can basically describe any behavior they don’t like at the moment of their choosing. Same as their definition of “racist,” or their definition of “extremist,” or,… Read more »
michaelzwilliamson
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

I chose my language carefully to hopefully reach a few of them, bypassing the trigger words (linguistic meaning, not PC meaning) that they’ve been taught to react to.

Fail Burton
Guest
Fail Burton
2 years 3 months ago
Debate’s not worth much when it’s nut farm time. Two small victories this week when it comes to mainstreaming hate-speech as “justice.” The racist Medieval PoC has stopped posting, as least for now, because its own racism brought attention and people started digging. The stoppage was not voluntary. QUILTBAGs in SFF were always linking to it. Surprise, the owner is a WisCon-ite and nuts. The most insanely venomous feminist I’ve ever seen, Shanley Kane in the world of tech has gone to protected Tweets for drawing the same attention. That was one of the most remarkable Twitter feeds I’ve ever… Read more »
Fail Burton
Guest
Fail Burton
2 years 3 months ago
You’re assuming we’re in an actual debate with differing ways of viewing this. Let’s ask ourselves a simple question: why are there two sides in this debate? Normally there’d be staggered and mutually intersecting and differing multiple viewpoints all dedicated to a single goal – diminishing rape: law, law enforcement, prevention, the criminal justice system, drinking, chaperonage, buddy systems, situational awareness, peer pressure, etc. Most of that is is rejected out of hand by the group most driving this debate. This debate is obviously driven by our QUILTBAGs. Only in their ditzy world does one have to spend much of… Read more »
michaelzwilliamson
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

Scalzi did link back to it.

Dunning-Kruger comes into play a lot. Guns are common enough that everyone has an opinion, the opposition simultaneously believing they’re too complex for the common person, and being sure they know all about them.

michaelzwilliamson
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

Sgt Jon, USMC was insisting I was crazy and reckless for teaching my kids to shoot at age 4 ( in comments). I went back and posted photos.

keranih
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

too complex for the common person

For crying outloud, the Army and the Marines manage to adequately instruct thousands of 18 year olds on how to safely use a variety of weapons annually. It’s not rocket science.

(And it’s even worse when that sort of statement comes from people who view military service as “the last resort of retards.” Not that every lib/anti-gun/anti-military person thinks this. Just too many.)

Fail Burton
Guest
Fail Burton
2 years 3 months ago
Meanwhile he won’t back off his position one iota. Anyone who’s crazy enough to support N.K. Jemisin’s WisCon speech needs to have their head (and rhetoric) examined, not debated with. How do you debate someone who parrots bell hooks and Melissa Harris-Perry by writing articles about white privilege? You win this debate by quoting the other side, not engaging them, because at this point, what’s left are too fanatic or out on a limb to ever back off. Arguing with Scalzi that ethnic European heterosexual men aren’t all that bad is like arguing whether trees exist, and Scalzi’s the least… Read more »
Wes S.
Guest
Wes S.
2 years 3 months ago

Speaking of strawmen: I think this one has already been mentioned in several comment threads, but here goes anyway:

http://www.tor.com/blogs/2014/06/women-destroy-science-fiction-sweepstakes

First time I’ve seen an entire anthology built around a strawman argument. Perhaps I should get out more…

keranih
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

with two long days of training take them from zero knowledge to being able to pass most police department’s basic qualifiers

*sigh* So much for the ‘but the police are so much more experienced and expert than ordinary mortals’ theme.

(That’s sad, that really is. Even for an awesome instructor, I would like to think that the police would set their bar higher.)

The Phantom
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

Cops shoot for certification once or twice a year. Most never even clean their guns more than twice a year. They are, as a class, some of the worst marksmen out there.

pavepusher
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

keranih, look this over. While it looks specifically to one (LARGE) department, I’m told it’s all too representative….

http://www.rand.org/pubs/monographs/MG717.html

dyingearth
Guest
dyingearth
2 years 3 months ago

correia45, on June 20, 2014 at 6:56 pm said:
Professionally, I found that I could take just about any regular willing student who didn’t have severe emotional or mental problems, and with two long days of training take them from zero knowledge to being able to pass most police department’s basic qualifiers.

Larry, I think you’ll have more problem with novice shooter than guys like me who have handle guns, but have pick up way too much bad habits to correct. At least with them they don’t have any bad habits to unlearn.

dyingearth
Guest
dyingearth
2 years 3 months ago

That should’ve been you’ll have less problem with novice shooter.

Synova
Guest
Synova
2 years 3 months ago

I went shooting today, hadn’t been for a while. My best grouping was 2 by 2 1/2 inches (low and to the left) at 10 yards with my 9mm Walther PPQ. I’m insufferably proud of myself at the moment. “Too complex for the common person,” *snort*

Girls like guns. 🙂

Now I have to do the (just a little bit) complex part and disassemble and clean them.

Synova
Guest
Synova
2 years 3 months ago

Crap… I go to brag and forgot to say 10 rounds, dangit. 10!

junior
Guest
junior
2 years 3 months ago

*sigh* So much for the ‘but the police are so much more experienced and expert than ordinary mortals’ theme.
—————————-

If you’re a regular over at Insta-pundit, then you quickly learn to hope that the ordinary mortals are a *lot* more experienced and expert than the cops are. I think today’s story involved a cop who accidentally discharged his weapon in a courtroom while demonstrating something to the court.

LittleRed1
Guest
LittleRed1
2 years 3 months ago

Junior, maybe the ossifer thought he could imitate Temple Houston (who was a gunfighter as well as a lawyer). Houston “inadvertently” caused a mistrial by sending the jury fleeing as he demonstrated what might have happened during the alleged crime.

Dianna Deeley
Guest
2 years 3 months ago

That was a very well-written, and nicely documented, piece.

I’m sorry that it will do so little good.

The idea of being helpless makes my skin crawl, and it’s terrifying to read so many people who seem to want me to be.

NKR
Guest
NKR
2 years 3 months ago

Excellent piece, I read it last night. Now if the usual suspects would actually read the whole thing.

45er
Guest
45er
2 years 3 months ago

“guns don’t rely on strength, only on mindset”

This.

Right.

Here.

I preach this until I am blue in the face and this is the most distilled truth I have seen in print regarding this concept.

Andrew
Guest
Andrew
2 years 3 months ago

What’s nice is that it’s true in terms of safety and utility, as well as efficacy.

Otpu
Guest
Otpu
2 years 3 months ago
Contrary to what the TSA might say a weapon is not a thing, like a knife or a gun. A weapon is a person with the right mindset. If you have the mindset of, “If someone tries to hurt me or mine I’m going to F**k him up as badly as I can with whatever I can put my hands on quickly. And if all I can get my hands on is his naughty bits, that’ll work too!” If a person, man or woman, has this mindset as their default setting it clearly conveys itself to a potential attacker thus… Read more »
Fail Burton
Guest
Fail Burton
2 years 3 months ago

I’m still waiting for Scalzi to blog about why wishing people to die a fiery death is actually a gender-awareness teaching moment that illustrates how the slang term “pussy”= rape because degree in philosophy of language.

J.Sullivan
Guest
J.Sullivan
2 years 3 months ago

That was a fantastic piece. Time after time, while reading I kept thinking,”Man, I’ve been trying to think of a good way to say that for years.”

It deserves widespread dissemination.

As a previous victims of sexual assault, I thank you, Mr. Williamson

Spacebunny
Guest
Spacebunny
2 years 3 months ago
As I stated on Twitter (more than once) – feminists, and The Chinless Wonder considers himself one, are not the least bit interested in educating anyone or saving women, all evidence points to this being true. Anytime you advise women to act in X manner (arm yourself, don’t get drunk at a party, etc) is met with much shrieking and hand-waving about “blaming the victim”. What is important to remember is that the shrieking crowd is not your audience, your audience happens to be in the wings reading, but not commenting on either side. You are not here to argue… Read more »
Noba Dee
Guest
2 years 3 months ago
I believe that almost all liberals suffer from a variety of mental health issues; often resulting in a lack of emotional development throughout their lives. I know this may seem contradictory to many who see them as excessively emotional; but, emotional maturity is determined by how one copes with their own emotions. The less control someone has over them, the more immature they are. This liberals live in a perpetual state of detachment from what a more stable person would consider the real world. They do not understand that everything in the world has consequences and in some cases refuse… Read more »
SteveS
Guest
SteveS
2 years 3 months ago

Regardless of whether any of the self-defense critics or people that are suggesting education is the only/best approach, this was one of the most concise and cogent articles on this subject that has come out in this whole ‘controversy.’

I disagree that no one will listen. While there are always some people that aren’t interested in having their position challenged in a any way, there are still some that can be persuaded.

SteveS
Guest
SteveS
2 years 3 months ago

My first paragraph could have been written better. My point was that this was a good blog entry that looked at comprehensive response.

emdfl
Guest
emdfl
2 years 3 months ago
As I’m reading this,I’m trying to figure out what the heck a degree in philosophy of language is. Sounds kind of like a degree in wymyn’s studies only not as hard… Somebody over on Vox’s(that racist dog!!11!111) site had a really good short comment on these humanoids. I can’t remember the exact wording, but it came down to the fact that libs/progs/ socs/femnazi etc DO. NOT. GIVE. A. DAMN. about rape – except as it can be used to further their various agendas. The only pleasure I’ll get from those on the wrong side of this issue (and most other… Read more »
Jeff Gauch
Guest
Jeff Gauch
2 years 3 months ago

Figured it out:

Wes S.
Guest
Wes S.
2 years 3 months ago

Oh, dear Gawd: “I need FEMINISM because men can still RAPE even without laying a hand on a woman.”

http://elmtreeforge.blogspot.com/2014/06/even-for-all-rape-culture-bullcrap.html

*blink blink*

Well…bless her heart.

*facepalm*

wpDiscuz